chris holloway wrote (see)

 Do you put function first or (in your opinion) style?

Matt C wrote (see)

.... Sure, function before style, .......

Chris, I know you mean well, but I don't see why I should pay £200 for a friggin' jacket and get a colour I really, really hate. For that kind of spend I want stuff to be exactly right. And I like wearing black.

Drop the funeral comments please, it's getting really tiresome. Death isn't terribly amusing, especially if you have lost a close family member.

Haven't read all the entries in this thread but I'll throw in my pennyworth.

I run hot and I have a fair amount of gear including two Paramo jackets, an early Alta and a Cuzco. I rarely wear them. They're too hot. I do wear them when the temperarure's around about zero degrees. However they are useful in slightly warmer temperatures when on a group walk, because the pace is usually slower than my own.

I was out walking last weekend and on the Saturday I wore my Cuzco with just a lightweight Merino wool T-shirt underneath it. In exposed conditions I recorded temperatures of -3.6 with the windchill. Initially I was cold but once we got going I was comfortable. Out of the wind, in the valley, the combination was a little warm but generally I was very comfortable. 

On Sunday I changed into the Merino wool T-shirt and a Paramo shirt (old style just 4 buttons to open up the neck, forgotten the style name) and a Fuera jacket. Even though the wind felt chilly I recorded a temperature of 5.5 degrees with the windchill. Generally the combination worked but I didn't feel as comfortable as I had the previous day. Mind you the walking pace was also faster on the Sunday. Despite the warmer temperatures I saw my breath coming out of my mouth on the Sunday but NOT on the Saturday. Go figure. By the end of the walk on Sunday the back of my Paramo shirt was wet, not damp, wet. So I'll carry on experimenting. Maybe I should have dispensed with the Merino wool T-shirt.

I also have a Montane 'shirt' with the Pertex/fibrepile combination. This too seldom sees the light of day unless it's around zero degrees. I just run too hot. But when it is that cold it's a great piece of kit. And the cross venting system was and possibly still is better than the equivalent Buffalo jacket.

BUT AS A CAUTIONARY note I have afriend of mine who's now 72 years old and the warm Paramo gear is coming in to it's own. Now at 72 he feels the cold more and the warmth of the Paramo gear is much appreciated. So, I'll be hanging on to mine for at least another 15 years and expect to use it more and more often as I get older. 

OK as you like, I still don't like black, but it is in fashion right now, it will be out in a couple of years, one trouble with black is, it looks OK new, then gets tired. (just like me really!)

So what colour (not black) would you be happy with? Short answer, no swearing

chris holloway wrote (see)

 black... it is in fashion right now, it will be out in a couple of years,

Good classic style isn't about fashion.

The other Paramo colour I like is cobalt. My Velez is Cobalt. Paramo red is also quite nice.

Mixed, jumbled, combined colours (a la Vasco or Vel Adventure) aren't for me. 

Drop the funeral comments please, it's getting really tiresome. Death isn't terribly amusing, especially if you have lost a close family member.

You are wrong. Listen to Ricky Gervais, for example, discussing how he and his brothers acted at the funerals of their parents.  

 Also it is perfectly reasonable for people to comment that someone dressed in black looks like they are off to a funeral. You have no business trying to control peoples' comments when you don't like them.

Also it is perfectly reasonable for people to comment that someone dressed in black looks like they are off to a funeral.

Of course it is, but he kept going on and on about it.

DandyMountainMan wrote (see)Drop the funeral comments please, it's getting really tiresome. Death isn't terribly amusing, especially if you have lost a close family member.

You are wrong.

I don't give a stuff about Ricky Gervais and how you found it funny. if *I* don't find death to be hilarious, surely that's up to me.

DandyMountainMan wrote (see)

You have no business trying to control peoples' comments when you don't like them.

I have every right to let people know that they are inadvertently causing distress. Chris could see that. In fact I'm about to join him in the pub

major, you probably had the "wrong" baselayers on. paramo does take some experimentation to get that happy medium. fwiw i wouldn't dream of wearing a merino baselayer with it. far too warm.

do you mean the smooth and fluffy sided shirt? if so, AND a merino top. not surprised you were hot.

Looking at Paramo gear you could imagine that they are consciously going for an anti-fashion/ function over form image e.g. using "real people" as models in their catalogue. Fair does, if that is the company philosophy and the gear is the main thing after all. They might even lose some of their loyal customers if they went all Finisterre.

But looking at their range they do appear to be trying to have it both ways e.g. by keeping stuff like the Taiga fleece and then designing  the "contemporary" looking Vasco. They are just doing it badly (in the view of several random posters on this thread). So hopefully this is providing some useful feedback to them (where's Skippy this week?).

Maybe they could have a Paramo Classics range and get someone in to revamp some of the other stuff?

where's Skippy this week?

Hopefully knocking up a Ladies Velez Adventure in a single colour  

Metric Kate wrote (see)

where's Skippy this week?

Hopefully knocking up a Lady  

ben you quite right. the difference with paramo i think is in their demographic. seeing someone under 30/25 wearing it will be a rare treat. the older demographic would explian their cascada trouser leg sizes.

i think they're trying to appeal to a wider age range and i think, getting it wrong. older people tend to be more rotund waist-wise - which is why their jackets fit me ok around the middle. it's ok stating a size as 40 chest but you'd be pushed to find a 32 inch waist to go with it.

the problem arises when you've sold probably to most of the demographic who are going to buy the stuff. the garment lasts a long, long time compared to others so they have to try to appeal to others. can't work out who with the colours though.

their range depends upon the designers and a fair bit of it needs a revamp, but like a lot of things, if it ain't broke don't fix it. buffalo, barbour and the like still make the same products they made years ago and have a loyal following for doing so. goretex was hailed as god; now you silly buying goretex when event is available. will the next fad be this plasma coated fabric?

meanwhile buffalo, barbour and paramo will still be selling the stuff because it does what it says on the tin; very well.

bugger fashion.

Well you may have a tubby waist, but I ain't  I found that the trousers were fine when I bought the short leg length

I do see some under 30s wearing Paramo, maybe we oldies don't take all the 'must buy' new miracle gear too seriously

I agree with the rest though

I'm sure you're right that Paramo will be fine. Depends what they want. They could take the attitude that they won't be happy while anyone's still wearing Goretex.

I recently kitted myself out and as I said earlier despite being very interested in the Paramo technology and the good reviews I found the range ugly and confusing which coupled with the price and the significant number of people who consider it to be too hot put me off. In the end I bought a Marmot Driclime windshirt, an ME Fitzroy primaloft insulated jacket (also windproof and pretty water resistant) and a Haglofs lightweight hard shell for the price of a single Paramo jacket (£50+£100+£30).  I'm well satisfied with my gear and it covers me for a wider range of conditions than any single garment. Granted I only go for shortish walks with the kids (the little one on my back in a Deuter) but still am out for two or three hours and am now happy to do so in most conditions.

No doubt I'll try Paramo one day or Analogy at least. I would still fancy a Finisterre Storm Track (if they get them back in, only small left at the moment) over the Paramos though and I'm not too young myself (40 next year). Maybe it's my inner scally* (I was born and raised in Liverpool after all).

Funnily enough Barbour are running a big campaign on the Brussels Metro at the moment - it plays on their English aristocrat image but still features pretty young things sporting the gear. So they still have to work on it.

*trans chav/ ned.