Just read about that myself over at the Independent online. In the end it is only the big companies that could afford to take such legal action though.
It is a double header though, as well as fining them over the counterfeit goods, they are also supporting restrictive trade practises, which is not so good.
About time Ebay got pulled up for the dodgy dealings that it allows to go on,and i hope that many other companies will follow this and get tuff on the scammers..
> It is a double header though, as well as fining them over the counterfeit goods, they are also supporting restrictive trade practises, which is not so good.
Yes, it's this comment that worries me a bit:
"They alleged that even auctions involving their legitimate perfumes were illegal, because only specialist dealers were permitted to sell them."
I imagine they'd argue that this restrictive practice eliminates an outlet for stolen goods.
Yes, the French are no strangers to using this method to protect various industries eg. Champagne, various cheeses (Italy too). However if I owned a registered trademark I'd consider it fair to have control over how the product is sold, second-hand goods excepted of course.
I accept that to some their tactics, or at least the reasons behind the verdict, might be questionable, I can't help but support an effort to try and reduce the trade in stolen and counterfeit goods. Apart from the moral aspect, it results in us all paying extra for everything we buy.
Why are Tading Standards not doing anything about online infringements such as this sale of counterfeit goods though?!
Good question Trevor, it would be nice if we could do something about it in the UK also. I have to acknowledge though that it's an incredibly difficult and complex thing to police and part of me feels some sympathy for eBay but I think they've really only paid lip-service to this issue in the past. Maybe this will convince them to make more effort. The major reason for their success is that it's so easy for anybody to create an account and sell anything with only a minimum of policing.
Ray Mear's own Woodlore staff people have for the last few years seemingly been policing Ebay themselves I noticed many times with interest, protecting their own brand 'Ray Mears/Woodlore' etc. Trying very hard at preventing people cashing in on selling stuff using his name, like army water bottles and basha sheets for instance. You would be amazed how many traders have tried to cash in on Ray's famous name on there- ie 'Ray Mears style' etcI noticed lots of different sellers sales being withdrawn from Ebay, after Woodlore began to get very much more corporate and professional at dealing with people doing what they thought of as 'harm to their brand'. The only things now allowed to bear the actual Ray Mears name label, to sell the on there, are the authentic Ray Mears Woodlore shop goods people sell on, and people doing private sales of old previously owned Woodlore stuff too.
Isn't this all complicated by Fleabay trading internationally?
As far as I can see, this was a prosecution of the French branch concerning a French firm and a French counterfeiter.
As North Face is sold mainly from China, are not the UK Trading Standards powerless to take action against anyone who is not a UK subject AND in a foreign country?
I am pretty sure that they would take similar action in the UK for UK based transactions if it were brought to their attention.
That's the way it's always been. If you wanted Ebay to police its site properly and check all items listed, you'd pay ten times as much in fees as you would to buy stuff. It's just a website, after all, and has a far less tangible presence than a box-full of dodgy DVDs at a car boot sale.
Then again, if Ebay keep being clobbered with hefty fines, then they'll take more notice of people's concerns. At the moment, it's up to manufacturers to complain about their stuff being ripped off, which must tie up their staff resources considerably, if they have to appoint people to spend all day on Ebay. Even if Ebay get fined over and over again, they can recoup their costs in fees, which comes full circle back to the poor punter.
I fail to see how this can be regarded as good news. Ebay is a minimum-fuss operation that works as designed 99% of the time. Obviously large corporations are not going to be mad about it because people are undercutting them. As for 'counterfeit' perfume - if it makes you stink on the bus, it's the real thing!
I fail to see how this can be regarded as good news. Ebay is a minimum-fuss operation that works as designed 99% of the time - Wrote NNPB.
Well, if that were the case then there would not be quite so many ripped off disgruntled Ebay customers out there like myself, would there now! Try checking the files of BBC Watchdog and also Money Saving Expert.com and other consumer champions websites, and you will see that the '99%' effective working is not really true. Although no doubt Ebay themselves would obviously like people to think that it was true. The trouble really is that their site was designed to work 100% on trust, person to person. As you know sadly people are not wholly like that. About 78% is nearer the correct figure of good transactions I would think. The rest is a mixture of sellers having problems, misdescribing items either by accident or on purpose, and a large dose of purely intentional criminal activity - some of which is even thought possibly to involve organised crime gangs.It is certainly true, that at any one time, there appears to be a whole host of real actual counterfeit goods being sold on there. It is the big designer labels groups that last year vowed together at a meeting of theirs that they would try better to tackle the issue. On the BBC Watchdog show too just last year, and partly in response to this issue being raised more widely, the management of Ebay promised they would themselves begin to crack down upon any illicit trading activities found to be operating upon their company sites.
I wondered how long that would take to surface Paddy!
The point Trevor is that there are exceptions of course, but generally, if you are very careful and use the site properly, then you can eliminate "most" of the risks.
In over 150 transactions, I have fallen foul of a scammer just once, and to be fair to fleabay, they re-imbursed the full amount as soon as I reported non arrival of the goods, and that was a completely unprompted action on thier part.
There are a couple of golden rules which I follow and they should protect people in the majority of cases.
ALWAYS pay by paypal - if they ask for personal cheques - money orders I leave well alone.
ALWAYS read the feedback and look to see what the negative ones actually say.
ALWAYS try to verify which country the item is coming from.
NEVER order anything from someone with less than 95-99% positive feedback, dependant of course on the actual total.
I am with Paddy, buyer beware. It is hardly fleabay's fault if scammers are preying on the naivity or GREED of some people.
If you accept that goods sold by fleabay traders would cost maybe 10 to 15 % less due to lack of overheads, then that is a reasonable margin of difference, but if something looks too good to be true, then the old saying goes that it probably is, and alarm bells should be shaking the computer!
I am also in aggreement with NNPB, the whole idea of fleabay is a no bells and whistles market place, anything else would be just too cumbersome and costly.
People who feel so strongly are not forced to use the site.
I had two cases Tony where I informed Ebay that I felt I was due a refund, after goods failed to arrive at all from two of the USA buys I made, and Ebay point blank refused me. They gave no reasons for this, and when I asked, I was told they did not have to give any reasons - so much for using Paypal! I also fell foul of some rip off things, where goods pictured for sale were the real deal, but those that were sent to me were definitely not as in the pictures. They were very poor copy imitations. Again on informing Ebay they refused to do anything at all about my problems. So I just stopped point blank using their site. Yes I did have thirty-nine or more trades on there done without problems, but it was the other five or six that went badly wrong. The fact I did my dealings through Paypal did not then offer me any comeback of protection or guarantee from Ebay though.
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I noticed lots of different sellers sales being withdrawn from Ebay, after Woodlore began to get very much more corporate and professional at dealing with people doing what they thought of as 'harm to their brand'. The only things now allowed to bear the actual Ray Mears name label, to sell the on there, are the authentic Ray Mears Woodlore shop goods people sell on, and people doing private sales of old previously owned Woodlore stuff too.
As does Woodlore, as I said.
