There have been comments that we get a lot of rain in the UK. I'm not sure I agree with this. Yes, there are days when it rains during part of the day, but it's unusual for it to rain solidly, heavily, all day. Of course, that _does_ happen sometimes, but you usually have pretty good warning that it's going to do that. Cycling to work every day means that I get to sample the weather, and I'd be surprised if there are more than 20 days a year when I need to wear waterproofs to cycle to work.
If you are unsure that soft shell is suitable for you, or you engage in activities that require multi-day protection from rain, where you can't retreat or survive the day, then the simple layering system of base layer, 100 weight fleece, water-resistant windproof and lightweight waterproof is a very versatile and can cope with a wide range of activities and conditions. In the cold, you can add a synthetic duvet to cope with periods of inactivity. For trousers, I'd go for Supplex or similar nylon, or stretch nylon, with a water resistant treatment. This is the system I would recommend to someone starting to equip themselves for the first time.
Whether you need a full-on _hard_ hard shell will depend on your activity. It may be suitable for activities where abrasion is likely, such as mountaineering or scrambling, but I think it would be OTT for walking, where there is little abrasion apart from rucksack straps. In this case, I think Paclite or lightweight Event are more suitable. Or Paramo, even...
If you do go down the soft shell route, and decide you need a waterproof, then get the lightest you can find. The argument is that you shouldn't need to wear it in anything but the worst rain, so it'll remain in your bag most of the time. I confess that, although I find my ME Microtherm mountain jacket good enough to fight off prolonged, moderate rain, I have yet to manage to wean myself off carrying a lightweight waterproof, just in case. I think I'll get there, though, as my confidence builds, and I pay attention to weather forecasts.
You might like to have a look at the following threads:
Captain's spot on. But, like anything don't just ask 'What's the best...', think about what you want it for.
For munro bashing, ptc may well be right that you really need a waterproof rather than water-resistant garment. However, for alpine climbing in cold but dry snow conditions, softshell comes into its own. In fact, for climbing in general, softshell is v nice. I have a Montane softshell which is at the breathable end rather than the waterproof end of the scale. It is DWR coated and has an outstanding hood but can't hack a real rainstorm (I have a lightweight Marmot Precip waterproof to go on top).
Softshell is quite a specialised type of lothing in my opinion and probably has a wider application when used for trousers than for jackets in the UK. If you want to read a couple of really good articles on softshell and how to use it/choose it, Andy Kirkpatrick - http://www.planetfear.net/climbing/highmountainmag/equipmentnotes/july2004/july04.html
Or have a look at Mark Twight's book on alpine climbing for nutters, 'Extreme Alpinism'. There are some very interesting arguments on the use of softshell with windproof shells but it does kind of reinforce that softshell is rather a specialised area of clothing.
It has always bothered me about the "in-all but the worst conditions" thing. Surely that's when you need to stay dry. I think the coldest I've ever felt was just above freezing, where rain and dampness seeped into virtually everything I owned, I struggled to get any warmth back into me, and I normally run very hot. I've been out in Siberia in February an not been as cold. I guess a lot of them do provide a little more warmth when damp, but it would still concern me if things turn really bad. I need to keep my core warm.
Softshell trousers on the otherhand. I got a great pair of north face Apex, which I combine with a pair of Montane windshell pants. These keep almost everything out if I put both on, but offer great flexibility in lots of conditions. The Montanes are also great to combine with long johns as camp wear should the trousers get muddy, dirty or just plain damp.
Just got back from a weekend in the Peak District. As you know, it was relatively cold and the northerly winds up top were biting. My "soft shell" (ME Microtherm MJ) was perfect in these conditions (in conjunction with an X-Static long sleeve base layer) because it provided wind proofing and insulation, but was also very kind to me when I worked that bit harder climbing hills due to its excellent breathability. Also, when we got caught in the odd snow shower it simply shed everything that landed on me, even when it melted.
As far as the "in all but worst conditions" worry goes, I would say "what's the problem?". When you're walking around, do you *always* wear a hard shell just in case it's going to start raining? I suspect that the answer is probably no because most people make some kind of judgement as to when they think they're going to need some waterproof protection, and that's not necessarily when the first drop of precipitation falls from the sky. It's the same with a soft shell, except you make that decision at a slightly different time.
I was out in the Peaks last weekend too - in a £20 100wt fleece and a pertex (£30). A combination which appears to do pretty much everything a softshell does but for a fraction of the price! Maybe it doesn't look as good?
And I carried my waterproof too, which most softshell people also seem to do!
The thing is though there are various variants of soft-shell and to be honest to group them all together is a hard thing to do. I own loads of different types each having its own + and - points depending on the activity..
I have a marmot driclimb and a Mtn hardware tempest shirt both similar with the tempest being slightly more water resistant and a rab vapour rise which is similar but has a hood.These ten to be summer pieces or winter base layers.
An arcteryx windstopper fleece which doesnt breath too well but is great for the pub :)
An arcteryx gamma MX hoody which i wear all the time except for when its really cold for which i have just got a patagonia Mixmaster which hopefully will prove to be very useful next week up in the cairngorms. Loads of stuff out there and it does get confusing but IMHO you cant go wrong with a shelled micro pile (Driclimb and the like) buy one and you wont be dissapointed.
Ah, but the Microtherm RRP is £80 (£90 with the hood). Whereas I was talking full RRP for my fleece and pertex combo. And in summer you can wear just the pertex on top of a short sleeved base layer so it is also a more flexible system in my view.
In any case, the microtherm appears to be a microfleece (i.e. 100 wt) with a close woven windproof top layer (pertex?).
Pertex over 100 weight: yes, see comments above, and in linked threads. Separate layers can also be replaced individually, and insulation weight selected to suit the conditions. As I said, a very versatile system.
Different types of soft shell: yes, see two long posts on the previous page; the one above was the last of a long 'post'.
Pick one to suit you and your activities: yup, completely agree <from Er- why?> "Of course, the selection of clothing depends on your preferred activities, and your physiology, so it's perfectly possible for everyone to be right"
Soft shell is often made from a stretch fabric. It's about the closest you will get to a hard shell in the fleece market. It's very durable and shreds snow very easily. (Very good for winter climbing). It also allows a lot of flexiblity and obviously is a good packable size. Windproof too. Go out in a softshell and you won't need a hard shell unless it pours down!
check out the mountain hardware synchro and manticore jackets. Fully waterproof/seamsealed softshells. The best of both worlds.
The very confused softshell market has been and still is aimed at the high-end user (mountaineer/ice climber). They are ideal for such, but it really should be aimed at joe public. Lets face it most people will buy a full gore-tex suit, but will head straight for the pub as soon as it starts raining, despite the fact many north sea fishermen aren't as well equipped! Softshell is really for most people most of the time, just round town chilling. If you are buying softshell for performance then you really have to think of most softshell as merely a functional fleece not as a replacement for any other layer.
Everyone should own a softshell if they can afford it, but it should supplement your outdoor wardrobe not replace it. Think of it as a more usable fleece not anything special, because the more things specialise the less useful they are for anything else!
I think one of the deciding parameters on whether you will be happy with just a softshell jacket or not depends on your individual "uncomfortableness" threshold.
When I was working as a postman I fairly often decided to continue to just wear my windstopper fleece (which was fortunately in an Royal Mail compatible blue :-) even in prolonged heavy rain. I found even after three hours it kept the majority of my (cotton!) shirt dry apart from a little bit of seepage through the seams. The outside of the fleece was usually completely saturated and dripping after a while and whilst I found this a little uncomfortable since I was moving at a fair old lick all the time I stayed warm and happy. As they say however "your milage may vary" and a lot of people may not be willing to accept the same amount of uncomfortableness.
The idea of technical clothing hasn't reached the Royal Mail yet and the alternative to my fleece was the full RM "proofs" which though completely waterproof are not in the slightest bit breathable and are also very heavy and bulky. I always found if I wore them then it usually took me 20 - 30 minutes extra to finish my round.
So, I guess in the end I have two points:
a) Whether a particular jacket is good for *you* or not depends on whether *you* feel happy with it. By implication this means that what *you* are happy with someone else may not be.
b) For all year round UK conditions you do not *need* all this fabby technical clothing to go outdoors. The postie goes out 6 days a week, 52 weeks a year all round the country substantially less well equipped than your average walker and the Royal Mail has very few clothing related deaths a year! Now, maybe those posties ain't necessarily always comfortable but...
How about the Paramo waterproof fleeces? Granted not lightweight but stick a Pertex top over them and they are very good at keeping out both the wind and rain. Alternatively a pertex pile garment (or aren`t these softshell?). For winter I use a Montane Extreme; summer a Rab Vapour Rise smock. Former hardly needs anything on top unless very poor conditions, latter another fleece +/- a waterproof will cope with all the vagaries of `summer` that I`ve met
