I also haven't had a problem with my Montane eVENT jacket (Venture). It still beads as new. I wash it in Tech Wash then tumble dry. I've sprayed it a couple of times with TX Direct.
True enough. I like to wear a windproof in preference, usually a TX'ed Fuera, and delay the need for a waterproof, and I've tried the Fuera-only route, but tbh I've encountered enough downpours, even in the supposed height of summer, to no longer go without a waterproof. On a wild pennine moor in freezing wind-driven rain is no place to be getting drenched, even if it is July! Even more so on multi-day backpacking trips.
But I find a simple Paclite smock waterproof plenty good enough and no burden at all - the early Berghaus one was excellent in its day, but at 170g and smaller than a coke can the Haglofs Oz is incredible, there's just no reason not to carry it.
I'm currently trialing a 80 gram PHD windproof with a Fuera outer to see if that gives adequate protection during a downpour. It's amazing how it doesn't rain when you want it to!!!
Two windproofs as a waterproof... better than one IME, but ultimately in prolonged and/or really heavy rain you'll get soaked. Once the outer one is wet through it will stick to the second and water will soak straight through with a DWR on the second rendered pretty ineffective because there isn't anywhere for drops to form.
So whether it's "adequate" will depend on just how special the rain is. Current temperatures getting wet is also a bit moot, but come winter is a different matter: vastly more comfort issues getting wet and cold, and that's where it can get dangerous too.
Re-proofing isn't actually much of a minefield, once you realise that "re-proofing" doesn't actually have much to do with the waterproofness of a garment.
In a typical modern breathable/waterproof you've got a laminate or coating layer which is fully waterproof. If this ceases to be waterproof you either patch it or buy a new one. "Re-proofing" will not really help much.
As well as the formal waterproof layer you'll have a "face fabric" that either holds the coating or has the lamintae layer attached to it. This is the bit you "re-proof", as if it gets soaked through the garment will remain waterproof (through the coating/laminate) but it will cease to let out vapour, so you'll get wet from sweat. To help stop it saturating, the DWR (Durable (hah!) Waterproof Repellency) treatment ("[re-]proofing") is applied which makes water tend to bead up and run off rather than soaking into the face fabric. Eventually all DWRs will be defeated in prolonged and/or very heavy rain and the face fabric will become saturated, but the garment will still be waterproof, though much less breathable.
"Re-proofing" just tops up the DWR so water beads up and rolls off better. It only affects the breathability of a garment, not its waterproofness, which is looked after by the coating/laminate layer which is independent of the DWR or any "proofing" the user adds. If the garment is leaking through the coating or laminate layer then you're just rearranging the Titanic's deckchairs trying to stay dry using wash-in proofings.
Sof shells (including windshirts) don't have a formally waterproof layer, so as soon as their DWR is overwhelmed (which will happen, gievn time and enough rain) you'll get wet inside them. Better DWR means you'll stay drier for longer, but that's not the same as "dry" and no amount of wash-in reproofing will alter that.
d briggs - you've only got two posts listed, so in case you don't know, in this thread you have contrubutions from a Trail magazine gear writer, TGO magazine's main gear writer, the editor of this web site, and (from what I can tell) several very experienced outdoor folk, so this thread should give you the current state of play!
Fwiw, I've ironed lots of waterproofs and not damaged any. OK, I did accidentally kill a TNF heat transfer label in a moment of reckless abandon, but as long as you follow the instructions on the garment care label and avoid ironing reflective and anything else that might melt, you should be fine. If there's a big pic of an iron with a cross through it, steer clear, but otherwise you should be fine.
The US Army’s Natick tests of waterproof-breathable laminates reported that eVENT fabric proved to be the most breathable of all materials tested, averaging twice the breathability of its closest competitor. Testing included the likes of Gore-Tex XCR®, Sympatex®, and various other waterproof-breathable fabrics. (source: http://www.feedthehabit.com/news/ground-wear-raises-the-bar-by-utilizing-event-fabrics/)
Funny that, thanks to what might have even been a spam post linking a website from a forum newbie, we have been pulled into the eVent XCR debate - especially as XCR isn't even a current product! The original question was posed in 2006!!!
But that being said, it is as David notes, a fine collection of minds that have been lured! My main reason for washing waterproofs is to reduce the effect of my own skin oils/acids from ruining the laminate. When I have had laminates fail on me, it has generally been in the back of the neck where the fabric is folded (thanks to the hood being off) and frequently in contact with my bare skin. I am usually able to find a hole created by my watch on the wrist as well.
And it won't do my eco credentials much good to admit that in the last decade or so, I have bought my jackets at heavily reduced prices (75% off for example) and retired them after a few years of use. I have tried reproofing products and have been disappointed with the longevity of the results. I know there's another way (aka Paramo) but I have yet to try it. So for now, I shall leave the rest of you to iron and tumble dry to your hearts' content whilst I live in a dry part of the world and hardly find an excuse to get my jackets out of the cupboard!
Why would you want to iron a waterproof jacket Jon?
The Montane Quickfire is my eVent jacket of choice and it is pretty light, lighter in fact than my Paramo Fuera smock. Good hud, good protection from the rain.
Does anyone know how Rab's hyperlite storm fabric compares to event and goretex exchange for use as a bivvy bag material? I use event or paramo for waterproofs due to breathability, but don't know anything about bivvy bags. Thinking of getting the 420 or 490 gramme sacks from Rab ones a cover the other's a traditional bivvy bag.
As far as washing is concerned, I only was the jackets or trousers when I intend to re-proof them. If they are getting very wetted out I hand wash then machine rinse before usiong techwash and TX10i direct (having run a v hot wash through the machine while empty first). I have not really noticed much performance difference if I washed frequently or less frequently (i.e. over 1 year).
All I know is that my mate has XCR and always seems to be wet inside and I'm dry in Event or Paramo. He doesn't weat any more than I do neither. Of course people are often too quick to put on waterproofs. A decent windproof will stop all but the heaviest most consistent rainfall IMO. I have yet to wear a waterproof for maybe 1.5 years now and despite this I have been comfortable (more than in a sweat suit).
