Gear

captain paranoia wrote (see)

As WH says, some meths burners object to removing the pan; side burners, for instance, can flare unpleasantly (one of the reasons I don't use them).

I assumed (incorrectly it seems) that you used a side burner Pepsi/RedBull stove, out of curiosity what do you use? 

wh i agree. my point is that a meths stove does have the flexibility to cook depending upon stove choice just as there is with other methods - you can do bugger all with a jetboil except boil water as with a side jet meths burner.

you need to use different methods just like home stoves. gas, electric and the invention of a satan imposter the absolutely useless halogen - although some like the latter they obviously don't cook anything on them (i hate ours with an extreme vengeance).

want to boil water use a jet boil or side burner. want to do something else use any other gas stove or meths burner (almost).

using your example wh a meths burner is like using an electric stove at home - turn the heat down and nothing happens for quite a while until the plate cools down except you lift the pan up instead.

edit: i'm getting very confused again.

so

choice of stove and fuel is very dependent upon what you want to do i.e. how and what you want to cook/heat/burn/boil/incinerate and th etype of route you're planning which may give a yummy thank my deity for that eating change.

so how much fuel to take? only you can really decide depending upon your culinary expectations. me? sod breakfast and lunch usually. they're combined into one usually rather nice (i can have quite bizarre favoured flavour and texture combinations) brunch type affair. during normal life the clock tends to control what and when you do things. when outdoors..who cares. whatever and whenever. there are no rules and no clocks.

Parky Again wrote (see)

. when outdoors..who cares. whatever and whenever. there are no rules and no clocks.

So true. Nothing worse than being with people who insist on eating lunch at 12.30pm when you know you'll be in the shade at that time!

My brother skips breakfast and has it an hour down the track when it's more pleasant and warmer and his stomach has woken up.

I often have 2 lunches: one around 11am and one later on. Both enjoyed in optimum surroundings.

I'd love to hear more about your brunch affairs with the bizarre flavour and texture combinations. As I get out at least 100 days/year I'm always looking for new ideas. Is there a thread on this already?I looked at the lunch one yesterday.

For the gas canister usage. I did a 6 day trip on one and a half 350g canisters for 3 people. For our 8 day trips for 2 people I carry 2 but never finish them both.

No, I don't like side burners for the following reasons:

i) they are a pain to prime (wait for prime, then lower pan slowly)
ii) they produce a wide flame ring, and I use small pans
iii) they flare when the pot is removed

I mostly use a red bull inverted conic burner with inner-facing jet ring:

This isn't the same burner, but the flame pattern is the same:

Nice.

I didn't like side burners for the same reasons but I believe that (for me) I've corrected them. I use the bottom of a thin can of deodorant (single wall construction) and an old shoe polish lid for priming. I put the stove in the primer pan, put meths in the stove, add a few drops to the primer pan and light everything. Within 30 seconds I can put my Alpkit mug onto the stove and away I go. I don't have to lower the stove into the primer pan, don't have to wait a long time to get a brew and have never had a flare up. It's not the most economical of stoves but I have found it to be completely dependable.

I use a windshield as well but I've removed it for the sake of brevity.

Interesting thread guys (how sad is that!)  For me it depends on what I am doing and for how long.  Meths (Whitebox or home made) for overnighters when boiling water is all that is required.  Gas (optimus spider) for slightly longer trips when more control is required and Petrol/Parafin/gas/whatever (optimus Omnifuel) for Cycle and kayak trips where I will be cooking food from raw so relatively long cook times and when i'm not sure what fuel will be available and weight is not an issue (relatively speaking).

 All used with a pot cosy of some description.

Steve D

> Within 30 seconds I can put my Alpkit mug onto the stove and away I go.

Fails problem 1.  I want a complete 'fire and forget' solution.

Deo cans are good, though, and can be the simplest possible burner; just hack off the bottom and make a simple open-cup burner.  Good for simmering, BTW...

Nice stove CP, is the inner wall shaped in some way (looking at the cuts) . You could probably make one using a deo can, bottom of the can for the fuel tank, top of the can reversed for the inverted cone.

I'm not a fan of side burners or any stove that needs either a priming pan or a priming wick but thats just a personal preference. I think priming wicks are the worst, if you don't wet them enough they burn out before priming and then you have to start all over again. Like you I prefer 'fire and forget', my stove isn't the most efficient but it'll reliably bring 400ml to a rolling boil outdoors on 25ml of meths using a cone windshield.

Yes, it's a cone.  That's how the Caldera Clone script first came about; I designed the conic section for the inner wall of these burners, and then thought 'hmmm...'.

Here's a cutaway view.  The upper cone isn't used; this was a special to play with jet pressure.

Here's a shot of what it looks like:

Lots more photos in my red bull burner galleryand associated discussion in the huge How to make meths stove Q&A thread.

Thanks CP, I didn't look much at the particular thread as I thought it was mainly about drinks can side burners although I did try a RedBull version.

What is the principal behind the 'conic' inner wall?

Originally, it was to increase the size of the vapour chamber in a trangia-style red bull burner, as I thought it might be too small.  The cone pointed down in that version.

Inverting the cone so that the smaller end is at the top allows you to put the jet ring inside the pressed dimple, so that the jets point inwards.  Other than that, it's a standard trangia-style burner, although with a slightly reduced diameter fuel pot opening.

I've made a template for the cone (using the side wall of a can), and that allows me to make them quickly and easily.  Hence the picture of rather a lot of burners in my gallery...

> I didn't look much at the particular thread as I thought it was mainly about drinks can side burners

The Q&A thread rambled on through all sorts of weird and wonderful burners.  It's quite a useful thread in that respect, and is stuffed full of links and useful tips.

Thats a good idea as with smaller diameter pots/mugs you lose quite a bit (most?) of the heat up the side with a normal side burner.