A couple of you may have seen my earlier thread concerning ME's 2004 Lhotse jacket, which in many ways is exceptional. Thank you for replying.

However, I have a slight further query concerning the durable water repellent treatment. Having washed the jacket, obeying all the rules about washing out your washing machine to begin with, and ironing / tumble drying etc, the DWR treatment was re-activated. But, as soon as it was "wiped" with whatever (a finger, glove), the repellency vanishes, only to be re-activated after another heat treatment.

It's a long time since I bought a Goretex jacket, since I've been a Berghaus that I bought in the early 90s. Is this normal? Unfortunately this isn't a one off incident, as my friend's Lhotse (also a recent acquisition) behaves similarly.

Any comments very gratefully received. In all other ways, it's a very good jacket, but this problem obviously affects the breathability of the jacket.

Hi Simon, I'd suggest contacting ME and asking them about this. I've only had reason to contact them once about a problem with an ME jacket, and they were very helpful.

Think you should be able to get contact details from their website.

Simon, that doesn't sound right. Go with Si.

I agree that does not sound good. I have a 2002 lhotse and the dwr stays active for 6-8 months at a time.I use nikwax to wash it in.

Adrian

I may be showing my ignorance here, but why does a Goretex jacket need DWR? I can see why a fleece would need it, but surely the goretex is waterproof anyway?

Goretex has two functions: it is entirely waterproof, and it is breathable.

While the waterproofness is technically unaffected by a problem with the DWR treatment, breathability is, as the water fails to run off the surface and can hinder the expulsion of water vapour through the goretex membrane.

Rob, simply put, one cannot (easily) push a jet of steam through water - it condenses. If the outer material (usually a Nylon weave of some sort) becomes waterlogged, the goretex inner behaves like a sheet of polythene; condensation forms on the inside. The DWR (beading compound) keeps water out of the outer material's weave.

Ah yes, seems obvious now! Thanks.

the problem is due to an improvement in washing powders. The new powders bond to the fabric and drag water through the fibers thus making your whites whiter! It can take over 100 rinses to remove these powders.

If there was any residue in the machine or you used a standard washing powder to wash you coat with this is what has caused your problem.

The DWR is applied by gore and is standard on all g-tex.

For the best results put a couple of towels in the machine and run it a couple of times with no soap to clean the system.

Then wash you jacket with pure soap flakes or N-wax / Grangers product.

Dry on the line.

Apply New DWR treatment.

Leave to dry

Apply heat.

another point to add would be that DWR applied to lighter fabrics wont last as log, simply put the old heavy faces held the DWR better and modern lightweight ripstops dont hold it so well, therefore re-proof more often to maintain DWR

Oby one,

This is a task for this week-end. All seems straightforward enough but how much heat?

Warm tumble dry. Not hot; you may melt the seam tape glue and end up with a ruined jacket. Check it regularly to make sure it's not getting too hot; certainly shouldn't be too hot to touch!

As for duration, the longer the better is the usual motto, I think. An hour seems to do the trick.

agreed CP.

I infact did some testing on the amount/type of heat needed.

1. left out in the sun on a hot day. Quite good results with some wetting out in a few areas.

2. Radiator. good results with some wetting out inside storm flap.

3. Cool iron. Very good results but difficult to iron all areas.

4. Cool tumble dry. Very best results with no wetting out.

Im not really sad this was something i for work so that we could train staff in stores in the best procedure

Don't worry about being sad; I've gone to the extremes of rinsing my Montane Krypton smock, weighing it from the washer, and then sitting in it to see if I got cold, and how quickly it dried out...

All in the name of kitmonster science, of course...

My tumble drier uses no heat on 'cool', just forced air. I guess that makes my warm = your cool.

Not as straight forward as I had first thought. I have done the hand wash thing with TX Direct Wash In. I want to spray TX Spray on. The TX Direct Wash In says let the garment dry. The Spray On says apply to a wet garment. Now, do I let the garment dry and then apply the spray on having wet the garment or do I apply the Spray On before I let the garment dry from the hand wash or does it not make any difference?

Why do you want to apply DWR twice? You should use wash in stuff with three-ply fabrics and spray-on treatments for two-ply fabrics, the ones with drop liners, usually mesh.

With washing machines btw, before washing the garment, take out the detergent drawer and wash off the old, gunked up washing powder, then run a full wash cycle through the machine, best at 90 degrees, to clean any residue out of the inner, then wash following the instruction on the care label and the cleaner.

Don't use detergents like Persil, Ariel or even Ecover, or non-biological, they all contain chemicals that will compromise the DWR. Use either pure soap flakes or a technical cleaner from the likes of Grangers or Nikwax.

If you do wash your jacket in Persil, don't panic. A few washes with a technical cleaner will get most of the chemicals out of the garment, it takes a lot longer with water alone.

Low temp tumble drier for around an hour. Remember they take a while to get up to temperature - will give the most even heat coverage. Don't use a commerial tumble drier though, they run way too hot.

Jon,

Thanks for your reply (and also Oby One). I wanted to apply the two products out of a misunderstanding on my part - I thought they were complimentary not either or. Anyway, I did the hand wash thing (with my wife's jacket)and when it was dry re-wetted with clean water and applied the Spray On. I only did the hand wash thing with my own jacket. I don't have access to a drier so ironed (that was pretty tense) so it will be interesting to compare the results.

Again, thanks for taking the time to respond.

Peter