Gear

My missus, Jo, runs at vitually poikiothermic teperatures when inactive and even relatively modestly cool nights can spoil her fun.

I've never used any down products, neither sleeping bag nor clothing as I've heeded the wet weather warnings but the warmth the weight ratio on down is seeming more and more attractive to us given Jo's shivering and Alpkit's prices.

What's your experience of down's effectiveness in Blighty?

Hi Nath!
I know how Jo feels, having just bought a PhD minim 400 (-5 rated) bag as my summer bag!! I have the Alpkit AD 700 which I've used through the winter - but at times have used it with a fleecy liner, and I have an Exped Downmat and a closed-cell mattress which help block cold from the ground. In retrospect I should probably have got the AD 900 and I may ultimately upgrade, if the winter camping carries on. Have had no problems with damp - though I've only used it 'car-camping' so far, and I've discovered I much prefer down to the synthetic bag I used to use - much lighter and fluffier to snuggle into!

Other suggestions - I keep thinking about using a Sigg bottle as a hottie; Nanok do some great insulated sleeping socks (I have particular problems with cold feet).
Alternatively - skin one of those sheep and a) shut it up and b) throw the sheepskin over Jo's sleeping bag! ;-)

My Gf is the same, she is always cold.

she has a rab s3 sleeping bag for summer which is rated to -5, its not the most packable or lightest bag but i didnt want to take any chances with her getting cold

ive always been worried about down and it getting damp but recently got an alpkit pipedream 400 as i was worried about it being cold over easter (which it was on the 1st night) and i think its great.

My mate got a phd bag in the sale and that looks a very good bag too but a bit more expensive.

also as an extra way of trying to keep the cold off we have a couple of self inflating mats and Em has some nice warm gloves and a hat

Everyone agrees down loses more insulating qualities than synthetic filling when wet.

But a wet synthetic bag is still bloody chilly. I know second hand from a mate who forgot to put one in a dry bag one wet weekend in Wales.

But if you get it wet then, to me, summat's gone badly wrong somewhere.

Keep the bag in a something that is guaranteed waterproof (like an Exped dry sack) and make sure the tent isn't about to leak and you'll never go back to synthetic.

As for jackets - I've worn a PHD Minimus under an eVent waterproof in horrendous conditions (hovering around freezing and fifty + wind). It got a little damp, probably from sweat, but it was still "lofty" and warm. Dried out quickly too. Not that it would have been my first choice of layering - got a bit caught out when out for a couple of days - but it worked.

Of course jackets are best reserved for lunch stops (under a bothy bag if it's wet) or sat around in camp. But again - wouldn't lug synthetic around any more.

And my girlfriend feels the cold here like all my other female friends appear to (Stick her in -20 back home in Sweden and she's fine! It's the humidity I suppose). She carries down sleeping bag and jacket and loves them.

got to agree...downs the only way to go...warmest gram for gram very comfy and more packable.
everything gets colder when wet so the simple answer is not to let it for the filium wear a waterproof over it when it rains like you would anyway and for down sleeping bags put it inside one of the more than adequate dry bags inside your 'sac
;)

The easiest thing to do it to ask yourself how many times you've actually managed to get a synthetic sleeping bag soaked.

If you've been camping for a while without making huge mistakes then go for down. If you frequently end up sleeping in a soggy bag then maybe you should just give up.

I'd not recommend down to someone starting out unless I was sure thye had a bit of common sense. It's the same with most lightweight kit, one of the trades you make for improved performance is a reduced tolerance of foolishness.

Just got back from camping in the Fannaichs. Used a Marmot Helium bag, rated -9, and wore a PHD Minimus jacket. As you can guess I run pretty cold. I was toasty warm and the weight was minimal. I didn't bother with a fleece, reckoning that I could wear the PHD if I needed to - which I didn't, it was great weather. Can't recommend down too highly. I'm also a (very) restless sleeper and often wake up with my feet pressing the tent inner against the outer and a slightly soggy bag. Surprisingly this didn't seem to reduce the insulation value that I could notice. Even in extreme conditions. And this from a man who has been known to walk in a down jacket and a Paramo Alto. I would say to go for it.

That's really helpful and encouraging. Thanks all! I think I'll be getting some of the fluffy stuff with confidence.

Glad we all helped :)

Simon - Nice camp spot! I'm curious - what did you use for the sleeping mat?

Glad we all helped :)Simon - Nice camp spot! I'm curious - what did you use for the sleeping mat?

Hope these ideas are of use for everyone feeling the cold...

-I know it sounds obvious but wearing more clothes inside your sleeping bag really boosts warmth, in particular wearing socks will keep you feeling cosy (espescially if you suffer from poor circulation), aswell as keeping your head well insultated with a hat.

-A thick carry mat, aswell as being more comfortable, will insulate you better from the cold ground.

-In addition to a carry mat you could also place a foil heat reflector (you know the things you put on car windscreens)under your sleeping bag, to reflect more of your precious body heat back onto you.

-Use a liner, it adds extra warmth and prolongs the life of your bag. Silk ones are the best.

-Improvise a hot water bottle by filling a sigg type bottle with boiling water, and putting it in a sock.

-If all else fails a wee (or a large!) dram before bedtime is bound to warm you through.

As for down I would definately recomend it, there really are no substitutes as yet which can match it for warmth, packsize and weight. Watch out for condensation, there is no escaping it in cold tents, down doesn't like the damp. BTW I have just bought a Alpkit fillium smock and have to say i'm very impressed!

Not to be pedantic but alcohol actually makes the body's respond to cold worse as it causes the blood vessels to dilate which causes blood to rush to your skin making you feel warmer and chill faster.

It's a nice comfort if it's just a bit chilly but not to be advised if it's REALLY cold.

I was wondering if anyone would point that out, your right alcohol isn't advisable in serious cold situations.