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Torch Fiasco Underlines Tibet Repression
 
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Torch Fiasco Underlines Tibet Repression
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Torch Fiasco Underlines Tibet Repression
Everest Olympic torch stunt shows the true nature of the repressive Chinese regime.

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John Bailey
02/05/08 00:17
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Not too keen on repressive regimes round here then?
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Montgomery Wick
02/05/08 05:52

I'm not sure talk of 'Cultural Genocide' is useful. The problem in China is one of a corrupt, unaccountable 'elite' exploiting the poor. In Tibet, many of the poor are Tibetan, so they cop it. In Xinjiang, where I live, it's the Muslim Uighur. In most of China it's just their fellow Chinese. This kind of exploitation is not peculiar to China.

I'm actually heading back (briefly) to the UK in less than two weeks. This morning I've been working on the following text for a blog I was writing. It's not finished yet, but I'll post it as is. Some of the phrasing/tense structure will sound odd in the context of an OM forum post, but anyway...

-------------------
So, one year on. I’m back in the UK (briefly) and I thought I’d close this blog down with a final post. While the BBC was recently opened up in advance of the Olympics, many blog domains are still shut off behind the Great Firewall. It’s been an interesting year….

I’m not sure whether I’ll be going back to Urumqi. This is partly due to personal reasons, mainly my own character flaws and life priorities (!), but also because of the yawning cultural chasm that’s opened up between me and my Han girlfriend in the wake of the Olympic/Tibet controversy.

Let’s get one thing straight: Western media coverage of China and the Tibetan situation is far from objective. China is portrayed as a nation where brainwashed people cower in fear of a centralized dictatorship, crushed beneath the jackboot of the CCP. I’ve been living in Xinjiang on and off for three years now, a province which has similar issues to Tibet. Of course, Muslims aren’t as sexy as Buddhists so they get less media coverage. There are many problems in China, some of which I’ve mentioned in this blog, but I simply don’t recognize the picture painted by Western media. That isn’t the country I’ve been living in.

Too much Western commentary on China is being framed through a lens looking 20+ years into the past, and the past is a different country. There have been huge changes there, even since my first visit in 1993. My overwhelming impression of China and the Chinese has been quite positive. On a personal level, one to one, I encountered great friendliness and humanity. In many ways China could teach the UK a few things. No fears about getting glassed on a Saturday night, or being mugged when walking around city streets in the dark. Families leave their toddlers to play alone on the grass in communal areas, unthinkable in the UK. People generally rub along with good humour, despite conditions being more cramped and basic than the UK. This wasn’t some Potemkin Village constructed for my benefit, it’s just how day-to-day urban life is there.

However, the whole Olympic/Tibet thing has exposed a collective mindset, as a culture/nation, that worries me. Check out the comments left on Chinadaily to see what I mean plus, increasingly, the postings on western newspapers (often purporting to be the views of foreigners rather than Chinese).

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Montgomery Wick
02/05/08 05:52

What really concerns me is that there's no debate. It's ALL coming from exactly the same viewpoint - 5000 years of culture, you don't know Chinese history, western media is anti-China, what about X/Y/Z that the West did in the past, you're just jealous now China is getting strong, soon we'll repay you yang gui zi for the Eight Nations' humiliation, yadda yadda yadda. It's infantile, just like the official attempts to control the media. They have real points to score (genuine development in Tibet and Xinjiang, Western bias), but it's being drowned out by a tide of uninformed, triumphalist jingoism. It's not a bunch of redtop reading, BNP-style knuckleheads making these statements. By definition of the fact they speak English, they're the educated elite, the people who will be shaping and influencing public opinion in years to come.

One also has to wonder about the moderation policy of a national media resource that permits blatantly racist and xenophobic commentary, but deletes temperate & reasonable posts expressing a different opinion. I know, I've tried in the past (from cybercafés…). In fact, one recently made it through (link), I’ll be interested to see what the response is…

There’s a fundamental lack of understanding about the way debate and the political system works in the West. The best example I can think of is Iraq. When I talked about, for instance, Chinese policy in Tibet (good and bad), I just got Iraq thrown in my face – and what could I say? All I could fire back is that over a million people demonstrated against the Government on the issue (without being shot in the streets), and it sparked discontent among the public that resulted in Blair losing his job and, possibly, will ultimately contribute to Labour being kicked out. Is it enough, or are Chinese people right to be sceptical?

-------------------

Not quite finished, but you get the picture. It isn't as black and white as some elements of the media would have you believe.
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Parky Again
02/05/08 08:39
thought provoking comments mw.
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Ddyrchafedig Gyrrwr (Beic Modur)
02/05/08 08:54
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Yes parky, I agree with one caveat, I don't think it is so much anti Chinese sentiment, but anti Chinese COMMUNIST sentiment.

It is the political system and political masters who abuse their power with brutal efficiency that the west doesn't like, not the people!

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Jon Doran
02/05/08 09:32
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Not overly keen on repressive regimes no. But leaving that to one side for a moment - I do think there's a massive irony that the whole Olympic thing, which is intended to promote China in a positive light, is starting to do the opposite precisely because of the way the Chinese government is handling it.

As far as Tibet goes, yes, I take Monty's points about economic development and yes, the coverage in the western media is a tad one sided, but that doesn't excuse the influx of Han Chinese into the country or the heavy-handed treatment of the native population. It's a bit like pointing out that Mussolini made the trains run on time isn't it?

Ultimately this is an outdoors web site, not a political one, but the Olympic torch on Everest isn't doing the Chinese any favours. If they had their heads screwed on, they'd be using the event to build bridges not metaphorically barricade them. What benefits are the Olympic games bringing to Tibet? Tourism via the new road to EBC maybe? 

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ALoveSupreme
02/05/08 10:02
cysgod-du (Grand Slam 2008) wrote (see)

It is the political system and political masters who abuse their power with brutal efficiency that the west doesn't like, not the people!

As when a country is taken to war on the basis of imaginary weapons of mass destruction for example.

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Ddyrchafedig Gyrrwr (Beic Modur)
02/05/08 10:13
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I am not going to get into a tit for tat debate over the ethics or not of UK foreign policy ALS,

suffice to say that you can voice opposition of your Government without the fear of being shot dead!

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chris holloway
02/05/08 10:52
 Rookie 46 forum posts

This is the Olympic Games, Sports people getting together. Why oh why does pollitics have to come in to it at all. The same thing happens every four years. I guess the press are as much to blame as anyone

I wonder what will be the 'story' in 2012

Remember the 'good old days' when it was an amsteur event and sports people did it for FUN and PRIDE

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Ddyrchafedig Gyrrwr (Beic Modur)
02/05/08 10:59
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I think that part of the problem with the politics stems from the cold war days when repressive Governments (of both persuasions if you like) had to convince thier population that their way of life was best.

Sporting success meant at that time that they could bullshit their people. It also meant that if the rest of the world was willing to "play" then it was an endorsement that the regime was legitimate.

Not too sure if it is still such an influence in this day and age, but I rather suspect that it is as far as the Chinese Government is concerned after the debacle over the torch!

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Ace High
02/05/08 11:33
 Rookie 3237 forum posts 32 photos 8 reviews 2 bookmarks

Thanks for posting that MW; it's good to read something of this nature from someone who has been immersed in the culture.

I'll pop over to the blog later to read more.

 Best wishes.

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Ian Brookes
02/05/08 13:08
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Awarding China the Olympics was madness and this Everest opening event is beyond belief.

I for one won't be watching the Olympics, and most people I know won't be either.

Let just hope we are out of Iraq and Afghanistan by 2012 or we might have more of the same against us. The Olympics is a political football now, there is no getting away from it.

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chris holloway
02/05/08 13:48
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Well I WILL be watching the Olympics, Why cut off your nose to spite your face? It is just a sporting event, as for the torch, it has been used by some to stir up trouble, the same thing will happen in 2012. (Bets at 1000 to 1 sounds reasonable) just why will you not be watching Ian? A lot of athletes have worked very hard to get there, do you not support them? Will you watch the 2012 games?
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Ian Brookes
02/05/08 14:10
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Just voting with my feet Chris, no point bleeting about Tibet and then sitting down with a bag of popcorn and watching it.

Demonstrating about the Chinese oppression of Tibet and its oppression of its own people especially in rural communities of China, is not 'stirring up trouble' as you put it. The Beijing Olympics have given these people a voice that they never had before, how can you blame them for using it.

Awarding China the Olympics has tarred the whole Olympic movement and what it stands for, its a total joke. All the Olympics has done for China instead of opening it up, its just given them the green light to trample over anyone who gets in their way.

Who is going to get it next, North Korea, Zimbabwi..?

Also a lot of the enjoyment has gone for me too wondering which athletes are on performance enhancing drugs or not.

And as for 2012, sorry to be cynical but all thats done for the regions like the Northwest is to take money away and funnel it into London. We desperately need investment here and have to beg for scraps, for local sporting projects and what do we get from 2012, nothing, trust me I've spoken to our local council, not a drop.

The Olympics in England like China will only benefit a very small area and amount of people. Most of our country and theirs will feel absolutely no effect from the games other than money been driven away from the needy.

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chris holloway
02/05/08 14:18
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Oh No Ian, not that old thing about London and the North again, when will you accept that London is the capital city, that is where the games should be, that is where the world expect them to be, stop bleating and support your country. Do you really believe that if we did not have the Olympics, the 'needy' would gain?

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Ddyrchafedig Gyrrwr (Beic Modur)
02/05/08 14:27
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I take your points on board Ian, but I do wonder if sometimes, the Olympics might have the opposite effect.

It was certainly so during 1936, when most of the world opposed the German Fascist regime and the Olympics actually had the effect of disproving the core racial element of Arian supremacy.

It might have actually contributed toward the solidarity that eventually defeated the Nazis, who knows?

This Olympics have given the opportunity to the Tibetan people to make their case more widely known, and certainly, this has been a huge embarrassment for the Chinese, whatever public face and bravado they put on it.

The Olympics MIGHT be the catalyst that starts change in Tibet, one thing is certain, whenever isolationist polices have prevailed, not much changes.

I think the Tibetans might disagree with you, and from this point of view, it has certainly given them the opportunity to further their cause!

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Ian Brookes
02/05/08 14:47
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cysgod-du (Grand Slam 2008) wrote (see)

I take your points on board Ian, but I do wonder if sometimes, the Olympics might have the opposite effect.

It was certainly so during 1936, when most of the world opposed the German Fascist regime and the Olympics actually had the effect of disproving the core racial element of Arian supremacy.

It might have actually contributed toward the solidarity that eventually defeated the Nazis, who knows?

This Olympics have given the opportunity to the Tibetan people to make their case more widely known, and certainly, this has been a huge embarrassment for the Chinese, whatever public face and bravado they put on it.

The Olympics MIGHT be the catalyst that starts change in Tibet, one thing is certain, whenever isolationist polices have prevailed, not much changes.

I think the Tibetans might disagree with you, and from this point of view, it has certainly given them the opportunity to further their cause!

Grand Slam... I actually agree with you totally on the point above. I'm sorry if you mis-understood my point.

Yes all the coverage has given the Tibetans a voice as I mentioned I think in my post and I can only pray that it helps make the changes we all hoping for, but I doubt it.

Money comes into play here, China being the next global economic superpower means all other considerations are secondary, i really do hope I'm wrong.

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Ddyrchafedig Gyrrwr (Beic Modur)
02/05/08 14:57
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Ah, and on your last point, I am also very wary and in agreement with you.

I know of soemone working for British Aerospace in North Wales.

They are having some sort of fundraising event as someone they know is "connected" with Tibet.

I commended him but at the same time pointed out the irony that his job, and that of his colleagues is totally reliant on the fact that they are making the wings for the Airbus that is being purchased in large numbers by China!

 Politics aside, like it or not, we HAVE to do business with them!

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Ian Brookes
02/05/08 14:57
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Chris,

Senior government figures have alreay openly admitted that money is drifting away from the regions to help fund the Games, its not a big secret.

Yes fine London for the games, its the capital city, I understand that, but again the nation takes the strain but only a few benefit. How are kids in many run down northern towns going to benefit or make use of new olympic facilites in an already rich thriving city down south?

No, maybe the needy wouldn't gain either if we didn't have the Olympics but £9 billion or more, value for money? Amazing this amount of money can't be found in the UK when we really need for something to benefit the whole country.

I know we won't agree, best leave it at that, you watch the Olympics, I'll just head for the hills instead, everyones happy.

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chris holloway
02/05/08 15:51
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I bet my hills are better than your hills!!!!!! Have a good day Ian
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