 Good news, but still mad. Given that Snowdonia has no foot and mouth, why is it taking so long to open up. And can anyone explain why Glyder Fawr is deemed safe for walkers and climbers, but Glyder Fach is off limits?
Has anyone told the local sheep that they can't stray from one mountain to the other a few hundred yards away?
Am I missing something breathtakingly obvious here?
Jon
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 Who has made these decisions? And who did they consult with? Simply calling up and asking these questions, stating that you're a journalist, may get things moving. Get muckraking, Jon!
--Mjausson
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The decisions are made by the local authority, or in this case, the local park in consultation with local landowners / tenants, viz, farmers.
One of the major problems with the re-opening programme is that it's based on an assessment of each, individual right of way in conjunction with, you guessed it, farmers... and landowners. The Ramblers are being extremely well behaved for political reasons, since they're in the process of negotiating over the open access conditions with government, landowners, local authorities and, er, conservation interests, so they don't want to rock the boat. Hence their current toothless demeanour.
The only way this thing is going to speed up is if the government enforce blanket re-openings in low-risk areas, which they are reluctant to do because the government wants to keep everybody except walkers, climbers and mountain bikers happy, and particularly farmers, since the latter obviously know something so bad about Tony Blair that he will do anything to stop it getting into the public domain. End of story. End of access.
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 Controversial John, but probably true. Actually I'm loth to support ANYTHING the RA suggest, on principle, so I hope they don't get too involved with it all or I'll suffer a conflict of interest. There's always bound to be odd things which seem (and probably ARE) illogical, but I think it's best for the moment just to enjoy the parts that ARE open and wait and see, at least for a while.
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That's a cop out, Jon. If you're upset, get on the phone and ask questions. Who exactly in the local park made this decision? If there was a vote, who voted for and who against? Who are the landowners/tenants/etc that were consulted and what were their arguments against opening? In what way do these arguments not apply to places within the same jurisdiction that are already open? The publish your findings. The Ramblers may have to pussyfoot around the issues here but what's to say that this site has to? Or is Magicalia a subsidiary of the NFU?
If you don't want to personally get involved, at least research and publish and article about how individuals can protest against the remaining closures in their favourite places. Fax numbers to the relevant national park autorities and form letters. That sort of thing. You're uniquely positioned to stir up trouble. If you don't want to take action yourself, at least use your position to point people in the right direction. I don't understand why you haven't done this a long time ago.
--Mjausson
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 The government and local authorities know just how much people like us want access once more. But they have to be seen to be taking precautions still, imagine the flak they'd get if a farm got F&M. Then we'd be back to square 1. The best way really is to keep waiting, and let things open. This weekend a few areas of the peak opened, (there's a list at, um, www.derbyshire.org.uk? no that's a lie, i can't remember where it is, Jon knows loads anyway), and there are more set to be opened. Give it time, and blame the government for letting us buy so much foriegn meat instead of blaming them for not letting us walk about.
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 What can WE as a group of individuals do???
There are far to many vested interests at risk here, and now the election has been called, Foot and Mouth will be a total non-story.
As Jon 'the journo' will tell you, a news-story is a non-story when nothing changes in it. And as the continuing saga of foot-and-mouth is of a relatively few number of new infections daily, no big new develpoments and continuing closure of paths, then the media will just look at another story.
Now there's the biggest story around produced by 'Our Tony' and Foot and Mouth will just be forgotten.
As for us...we'll just have to sit and take it, we have no 'voice' to fight our corner, as all the representative groups are just more vested interests. (The BMC..."let's organise our next holiday to the Himalaya and get someone else to pay for it"; the RA..."This foot-path was used by King Harold on his way to the Battle of Hastings and you want to build a swimming pool over it.")
Maybe Mjausson is right, we need a militant walkers group who aren't concerned with being nice and fluffy (like the RA) cowtowing to the landowners and government. Maybe the country is ready for a "Friends of the Earth" type campaign/pressure group.
I'd join a group like that!
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Me too. I have actually considered what would happen if I announced on the web site that I was going to walk or run on a closed path in the Peak to publicise the lunacy of the whole thing. I am actually prepared to do something like that just to draw attention to the situation, but I really don't think that anyone would give a stuff, or at least the national media.
Quite interesting visiting London where foot and mouth is effectively something most people watch on television. Round here all the paths are closed though I can legitimately run along a road and blow kisses to the sheep on the other side of the dry stone wall four feet away.
If the government had started closing roads and come up against the motoring lobby things would be very different I reckon.
So, what does everyone think? Should I do it. Will anyone chip on for my 5000 quid fine?
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First of all I don't think that the powers that be understand how fed up we are. The reason being that we haven't told them. They confer with landowners because they have to. But they don't confer with me or Jon or any other walkers for that matter. What I'm suggesting isn't forming a group, they just get bogged down in committees. What I am suggesting is simply making it easy for individuals to register their discontent. We don't need groups for that. We also don't need the media. They'll come all by themselves if we get this thing rolling. If we're not going to take any action unless we're guaranteed the desired effect we're a bunch of spineless wankers.
Practically I would like to see a list of authorities that keep paths closed. For each authority there is a fax number and a form letter. All people need to do is, print off the letter, sign it and send it to the fax number. The letter should contain a URL to an article on this site explaining why keeping paths closed doesn't make sense and updates about how the authorities have reacted. A press release wouldn't go amiss either. It should have a URL to the page with the list, an explanation of what people can do and why keeping footpaths closed doesn't make sense.
This type of direct action works for people from Amnesty International to fuel protesters. Is there any reason why it wouldn't work for us?
--Mjausson
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 I'm just going to make you all jealous by going off and scrambling up Y Gribin, as I live in Bangor. Bye bye!
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Show solidarity with the cause by boycotting Y Gribin yer turncoat strike breaker... grrrr
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 Has anybody else considered that along with this thing that Tony's calling, there's also something far more imnportant - the local council elections. How about asking the candidates what their position is on opening up the footpaths and bridleways - since it's the local councils who seem to have the ultimate power at the moment. Let's make this an election issue - I reckon there are enough people sufficiently concerned about this to make a difference in the elections.
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 Is it me or has acess and foot and mouth turned into some form of political game withe the score at the moment being Walkers etc 1 Maff |GOverment etc 1000 or am I just beimg incredabbly cynical like most uni students? who incidently the government had better do something about tutuion fees and top up fees otherwise I think that Tony and His cronies might have a shock!
What can we do about this? at home (BANES formerly avon) all Paths etc closed and it has been (touch wood) one of the few counties who have had no cases!!!
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Mjausson...I don't quite understand your arguement. No media but a press release, no group but organised protest and a campaign? If a group isn't there to have a banner for all to flock to then all the individuals are nothing. Remember that the chairman of Ron Hills did something similar to that which you suggest and he made the news once but was then ignored. A group organised would do better.
The only way to get something done, is to get mass publicity, and to use it properly asking for realistic aims. (The 'cumbria in crisis' geezers got on the news ok, but they are asking for £12billion in compensation...unrealistic and provokes the bunch of idiots reaction). Yes, mass mailing works but form letters are often dicounted (go and ask any council planning dept about planning permission objections), and petitions are ignored (how many Mickey Mouses and Adolf Hitlers signed?).
The mass media works...look at Pheonix the calf for crissakes!
And Jon, I'd chip in a fiver to help you out! But I think that if 1000 people did a mass tresspass then it would have more wieght in the media's eyes. But then, the election has killed the foot and mouth story faster than a slaughterers bolt gun could ever have.
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1000 people doing a mass trespass. It's a nice idea, but if you compare it to (last year?) when a few hundred did that big trespass/destrustion of the GM trial sites, then it could cause problems. I think the Ron Hill guy had the right idea, but there just wasn't enough of it. We need more people like this to give the effort some weight.
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That's exactly wot I'm talking about...more people more weight!
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 Sometimes a little patience is needed. I mean it's fairly obvious that Glyder Fach is going to re-open shortly after Fawr. Most likely by this weekend (No coincidence I'm in Wales then). I think the message needed to get through to the powers that be, is that WALKERS/CLIMBERS DO NOT SPREAD FOOT AND MOUTH. Scotland is a very good example. As the only area in the UK open for hill walking/climbing during most of the F&M outbreak it has attracted people from all over the UK, some even coming from infected areas (this I know for a fact). How many outbreaks of F&M (thank god it wasn't called Sole & Mouth!) has there been in the Highlands of Scotland?
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Err, Glyder Fach by this weekend er, today apparently.
http://www.thebmc.co.uk/outdoor/access/fmd_det.asp?area_dropdown=6&Submit=Find+Restrictions
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The thing is we've all been patient. Read the post's in the other threads that were placed at the start of the crisis and you'll see just how patient and understanding we've been. But I think that we've also all learned a lot from this debacle. I've learnt that the vested interests (i know i keep going on about 'em) don't really care about the individual walkers. We as a group of individuals have no-one who will put our arguemnents forward in a clear, logical and sensible manner without having one eye towards other things. Both the RA and the BMC have been guarded in their press releases as they are thinking about the right to roam.
At the moment we have NO right to roam anywhere, and we should be fighting this battle now and not the next battle.
As Mike D rightly points out no highland farms have got FMD and they are open to walkers from all over including those from infected areas in endland. It's time that all the amatures at the local councils and MAFF got real and it's time that we stood up and made ourselves heard...if only we could find our voice!
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But do any of you fancy being the guy on the news accused of starting the second coming of FMD? We've waited this long, a couple more weeks on SOME paths won't hurt too much will it? Explaining afterwards why it was a bit of a shambles would probably do more good and get less peoples backs up. I'm all for protesting when it's necessary, but to be hones, paths are opening, it's not in anyones interest (except perhaps the landowners) to keep them closed, and the more that are open by june the seventh the better (as far as the government are concerned)
Of course there's irregularities, but appreciate what is there and wait and see for what's not.
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