Notwithstanding the inclined ramp which is absolutely crucail, IMHO one of the best ways to see if boots fit nicely is if they make you want to smile when you put them on and shut your eyes. That's always happened with the boots that have lasted me many many comfy miles. Any niggles and your feet know it before your brain does and they tell your smile muscles about it.
Or am I just being a bit odd? That's been known too.
Funny you should mention that Richard. I judge so much kit by the initial feel of it. If it doesn't feel comfortable within a few seconds, off it comes, never to be tried again.
I don't know how people can suggest that Claire's boots are too large for her when her toes are hitting the end of the boot. Also, in my opinion, the finger trick is not a bad indication of sizing.
I don't believe angled boards are particularly useful as they in no way replicate the action of repeatedly banging your foot downwards. Plus the uppers often soften with wear making the boot feel slightly different than on initial try out. The only sure way is to get your feet measured standing up. I had this done at Allan Austin in Bradford and ended up with a pair of boots two metric sizes larger than my previous pair.
From the description of the fault with the boots I think it sounds like the boots are too high volume for Claire's feet, rather than too large per se. In which case there woudl be no point getting another pair of the same boots in a different size. It also wouldn't be that easy for the sales assitant to pick this up as to a degree they are dependant on what you tell them when you try them on.
I second John's suggestion, try a pair of volume adjusters. Brasher ones are generally available. If you don't fancy the full insole just cut them in two and use the heel portion, which would lift your foot up into a lower volume area (hopefully) and support the foot better against the instep of the boot on descending.
Incline boards give some indication, because if someone can feel their toes at the end on an incline board, it becomes very obvious to them that the boots are too small and they have a better idea what they're after in terms of fit. But I agree, it doesn't mean necessarily they're too large, possibly either too high volume or just not been laced tight enough across the instep. Unfortunately, some people's feet just aren't suited to certain brands, or even certain boots within a brand. No matter how much I wanted a pair of Zamberlan Trail Lites, they just weren't suited to me. Came away with a pair of Scarpas, but I would have liked the one piece leather. Ah well.
As for the brannoch device... Foot measuring is all well and good for a company like Clarkes who have all their shoes built to their specifications. When dealing with different brands, I can say from personal experience brannoch devices are about as much use as a chocolate tea pot, and even the guy that trained us on it pointed out that it only gave a rough indication, which we proved across all the staff that were there. Sadly, the only way to get a good fit is to know whether it feels wrong, and have a good boot fitter to point you in the right direction. Beginners in my experience are so paranoid about fit they start second guessing themselves, but the majority instinctively know if a boot is comfortable or not, and those that don't very quickly decide when you point out the obvious things to look for. As someone said earlier, if the boot doesn't make you smile as soon as you put it on, it's not worth considering again. A volume adjuster could be worth considering. Something else to try would be sorbothane insoles as these will pad the boot and also give you some improved shock absorbtion. Sounds like you did get sold a dodgy fit though... Not sure when you bought them, but for reference try and avoid saturday/sunday, cause that's when all the part timers are in. You stand a much better chance of getting experienced staff in the week.
As for the whole Millets thing... We're all owned by the same company, and you're right: Millets have been aimed at the family camping and less technical areas, so if you do want technical gear a GOOD Blacks is a better bet. However, due to the way the company works, some Blacks stores get very little more in the way of technical gear than Millets. And having worked briefly for an FAS owned store, even Millets are better than that in terms of gear!
If worst comes to worst, you could always sell the boots to a D of E group or at a climbing wall? Probably get most of your money back. How did you get on, anywya?
Brannoch Devices aren't supposed to tell you anything about which brand might fit. If used properly a Brannoch Device will give you the length unweighted and weighted of your feet both toe to heel and toe to ball. If there's much difference between the weighted and unweighted measurements then the foot is overpronating and needs stabilising, regardless of the footwear.
It does sound as though the problem with the Lomer boots is with volume rather than length. I agree with Jon that a volume adjuster could be the answer. But I'd also suggest that Claire has her feet checked to see if she's over-pronating, as this might be part of the cause too. When you over-pronate your feet flatten out and lengthen, which can cause your toes to hit the end of your footwear. This is amplified when descending if the boots are also high volume so your feet slip in them too.
With regard to fitting when I worked in an outdoor shop back in the late 70s I was taught the "finger down the back" theory as the key to boot fitting. It was the standard technique. I only learnt anything different when I took a Phil Oren Fitsystem course twenty years later. Without Phil we wouldn't have incline boards or Brannoch Devices and would fingers down the back of the boot would probably still be the most sophisticated way of fitting boots.
Anybody know which brands are best suited to narrow lower volume feet?
I have some Meindl burma, but must admit that they are a little loose for me around the mid foot area.
I am looking to buy some lighter weight 2 or 3 season boots and was interested in meindl air revolution, but maybe as they are the same brand they won't be right for me.
I have a similar problem, Julian. I was recommended a pair of Scarpa Peak GTX M2 boots, which although they're more strictly a trekking boot have been more than adequate for UK 3 season mountain walking. They've been great, and I have very happy feets, at last. Review here.
Having tried on lots of boots when I got my last pair I found Meindls to fit like sacks. Different boots by the same manufacturer can vary, but I would imagine that Meindls are always going to be quiet wide and high volume.
I guess I have a narrower foot than the 'typical' British foot, particularly at the heel.
Anyway, I found Scarpa and, especially, Zamberlan to fit me the best.
I wear Han Wags too, but they are designed for the wider 'North European' foot. Spanish and Italian boots tend to be narrower as, apparently, 'Southern European' feet tend to be smaller.
If you need boots and live 'down south' I'd recommend a trip to Peglers in Arundel.
