Hi
Looking through this months mag, I notice another review of a gas canister stove. Don’t you think its time responsible outdoor mags such as tgo which are supposed to be concerned with the upkeep of our unspoilt areas, should stop pushing these things out into the market. I am sick and tired of dragging some lazy pigs discarded empty canisters back from bothies and camping spots, the last one discoloured a good rucksack when it leaked rust all over the place.
When ever I see these things reviewed (even by the venerable CT) they forget to mention that after the first time use, you need to take two canisters as you never know how long you’ve got left in the first. Somewhat offsetting the “super light weightiness” of them. Its time to sacrifice a bit of weight & convenience for the sake of the environment and start pushing only refillable stoves.
Enjoyed this months issue by the way. Have ordered a copy or Mr Perrins Tome, will see how it compares with Alick Ormerod’s/Dons version that is falling to bits on the shelf.
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 While gas canisters are a problem, they are no more so than plastic bags, bottles, tins etc.
I would have more of a problem with everyone carrying liquid fuels such as meths, petrol, white gas and other more toxic fuels. Gas is a whole lot safer.
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 If we want environmentally friendly stoves, we need to stop using any with fossil fuels.
Biomass fuels (wood, natural oils from plants) are the only way we can get 'green'.
The only options in this extreme are the kelly (?)wood burning kettle and one company that does some sort of bio solid fuel. Personally, i'll stick to my canisters for now. Less chance of leakage, and if they do leak wont pollute the ground locally.
So if any fuel manufacturer is out there reading these posts, what's the chance of a biofuel powered stove? It should also have fuel readily available (more difficult).
The only alternative is to procure a supply of chipfat converted to a petrol like liquid, but this is too much hassle for most people (me included.)
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 Jim Brown 2, it's easy enough to weigh a gas cartridge to see how much gas is left in it. I can usually tell just by picking a cartridge up how many days gas is left in it. Almost empty cartridges I keep for car camping and using with gas lamps in winter.
A big point with the Jetboil stove is that it uses fuel more efficiently so less is needed, which is an environmental improvement over other cartridge stoves.
I've hauled out too many empty cartridges too and I wish people wouldn't leave them in the hills. However other fuels come in containers too and I've carried out empty plastic meths bottles, solid fuel containers and stoves and various smelly bottles that have held paraffin or petrol.
tdave roberts, in theory multi-fuel stoves like the Optimus Nova will run on biomass fuels - "rape seed (colza) fuel and similar fuel types", according to the Optimus website.
Meths and other alcohol fuels aren't petroleum based either.
A good wood burning backpacking stove is the Sierra Stove:
http://www.zzstove.com/sierra.html
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 Jim Brown 2 has a point – but I think it's time canister manufacturers started a recycling programme. It's not the canisters nor the stoves that litter the countryside, but the users.
Such a proper disposal scheme might also help those of us who end up half way through a backpack trip with only a slight amount of gas left in a canister: do we sling it in a bin and hope the bin wagon doesn't explode later? Do we burn off the excess gas to make it safe for disposal? Or do we carry the canister for the three or four minutes' fuel left inside, forcing us to carry an empty canister for the following few days?
And to be very fair to Chris his original review text did go into the issues of carrying more canisters for longer journeys but the lack of space in this issue meant some of the text had to be edited down. He's a lot more thorough than we're able to give space for sometimes!
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 John, is the full text on your website then?
Would Chris agree with me that the Jetboil is over priced for what is does?
Also what did Chris cook with his Jetboil? I'd be interested in hearing about that.
Basically I've had one since last July/August, and only use it to brew up on walks at the moment.
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Darren,
If Chris has no objections I'll try to dig out his full text and post it either here or on tgo's website..
I met a guy on the PCT who was using a JetBoil and I thought a bit unweildy. Several times, when he was tired, he spilled his meal out, and found it hard to clen because of the depth of the pan (or mug). In fact he'd cook his meal, eat it from the pan, then brew up a cuppa and drink that from the mug WITHOUT FIRST CLEANING THE INSIDE! After several days there was a thick crust on the inside, but still he cooked and brewed up in it.
On the other hand, his fuel lasted for ever – it was very economical in that respect. He was even able to give me a reserve fuel can when he left the trail.
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John,
thanks that would be much appreciated.
And possibly an idea for all articles in future, if they have to edited down for space considerations to place full text on website for those interested in reading more.
Did you happen to notice whether it was the Jetboil special gas the PCT guy was using or normal cannisters? Also did you notice what sort of things he was cooking?
Interesting to hear about him cooking with the thick crust, would this not make his Jetboil less efficient?
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not to mention having cast-iron guts...
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Uncle Gus, as he was known and loved, was using, I think, Jet Boil and SnowPeak Giga canisters. Can't remember what the former were like but the latter were astonishingly powerful and long-lasting. Often leaked as I threaded them on to my stove which I can only assume was a pressure thing as it happened with several from several different sources.
As for Uncle Gus's cast irons, perhaps we should have called hime Uncle Guts! And I'm sure it would have made his stove less efficient. I wonder if he's scrubbed it out yet? If not, he can save a few cents in food on the trail this year...
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Oh and as for putting up the original reviews... such heavy editing is unusual so the reviews wouldn't always read any/much differently. Plus I'm afraid it might take too much time than the system we have in place at present. Maintaining the tgo website is, I'm afraid, another, new burden on the hours we have in the office - the sort that managers take for granted!
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Darren, I do think the UK price of the Jetboil is very high. It's a lot cheaper in the USA! However it is the only stove like this at present so there's no competition. And you will save money on gas cartridges in the long run.
I've used the Jetboil on several trips and have cooked the usual stuff - 5-10 minute simmer dried meals and soups.
It is a little top heavy though I haven't knocked it over yet, probably because I've been using gas stoves that sit on top of the cartridge for years and they're all a little unstable. At least with the Jetboil the pan can't slide off the stove.
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“Ahhg” this thread seems to have become an advertisement for the jetwash thingy stove.
Chris I am sure a man of your experience can way up the fuel reserve to the nearest tea bag, but the type of person with the mentality to throw a canister into the nearest brook or whatever is not going to be bothered about that. I mean if they were really weighing you down you could at least bury them and let nature return them from whence they came. But people who leave rubbish around are usually more interested in the “adventure” rather than the scenery. With the MSR type stoves you can take a fuel tank as big or as small as you need so less chance of plastic bottles being left around.
And they’re fairly stable.
How ever I would agree that gas is a lot safer especially for those not confident with priming type stoves and having to cook in the tent on those ‘very rare’ occasions of precipitation. May be a £200 charge on the first canister; refundable on return would be the answer (I think that would cover a private firm being hired to retrieve your canister should you forget it!)
I rather think the pollution element of the fuel is not important yet, all the camping stoves in the world could not put out a fraction of the emissions of one Easyjet taxiing down a runway, or even the emissions produced in making all those canisters in the first place.
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Jim, I rather suspect that those who leave gas cartridges and other rubbish behind are unlikely to buy MSR or other expensive stoves. They probably don't read TGO either. I wouldn't want people to bury gas cartridges or other rubbish. Anyway, I doubt those who chuck them away would bother buying them either.
In terms of safety Trangia meths stoves are probably the best for novices and for tent porch cooking.
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 On the litter part of the thread - Good for you for removing the cannisters. Done it myself with empty water bottles and boil-in the bags. Must have been a banquet for 10 people - unbelievable.
There's hope but there's always going to be a few idiots out there.
Always pack a bin liner!
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I would not recommend burying rubbish either, I only meant as a last resort.
However the popularity of MSR & other similar stoves can only come about by such as ‘tgo’ making them “the” stove to have, and less talk about the efficiency & convenience of the gas cartridge.
Id forgotten about the good old ‘Trangia’ we use to back pack with one of those with an old brass primus inside, the one would prime the other & you’d get a double burner to boot. Mind you we used a Vango force ten as well, probably why my backs a shade delicate these days.
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Well, over the years I've recommended quite a few liquid fuel stoves (especially the Optimus Nova, which I've reviewed several times). However I only use these on winter camping trips or ones where I'm not sure I can get gas cartridges. Most of the time I use cartridge stoves because they are convenient and efficient.
MSR and similar stoves are much more popular in places like the USA where Coleman Fuel and similar is far cheaper than here. Also, in many areas of the US cooking is done outside (negatively due to the danger of attracting bears, positively due to sunny weather). Here cooking in the tent porch is common and for that gas and meths stoves are best.
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