I've been told I can buy a new jacket for Christmas, so I need some ideas.
I have Marmot ATV trousers, in the Schoeller 3xDry fabric, which I love. Initially I wanted the matching jacket, but now I'm not so sure.
I want something very water repellant, like the trousers are, so Schoeller fabrics would be good. But they aren't that wind resistant, and I'd like the jacket to be pretty windproof. However, I run hot, so it has to breathe well too, so Windbloc and Windstopper will make me too hot.
I'm still thinking along the lines of either Schoeller or Powershield, but I don't have much time to trawl the shops, if indeed I find what I want before Christmas. I tried on a jacket a while back in the Climbers Shop in Ambleside, that was quite nice, but I can't remember the manufacturer - all I remember is that it had a very thin "fluffy" lining, which at the time put me off, but thinking about it, may be a good idea. Other than the Marmot ATV (Schoeller) or Macpac Nemesis (Powershield), can anyone recommend others for me to have a look at (preferably available to try on in the Lakes this weekend)?
If it helps, I want the jacket for summer alpine use as well as wearing for climbing. It needs to be snow/water repellant, and close fitting.
Any ideas?? (if anyone has an opinion on the Macpac one, that would also help)
The Arc'Teryx Powershield ones are very, very nice, if you can find one at a reasonable price - at full retail, they're a tad expensive. Powershield is definitely more breathable than Windstopper btw, but don't expect miracles, it's not as breathable as the Schoeller stuff I've used.
I'd rule out Windstopper or any sort of waterproof softshell on breathability grounds.
Berghaus has something called the Lhotse, which uses Schoeller Original Softshell, but with a new DWR called Nanosphere, but the cut, although it's women's specific, may be a tad loose for you.
Have a look at GoLite as well. They do some nice stuff in a fabric they call Cynchronicity, a hooded one with a wiocking lining called the Evade and a hoodless one called the Destiny. Both in women's fit. They also do a Powershield one called the Momentum.
I'm pretty sure Haglofs has some nice softshell as well. Hang on...
Yep, Haglofs has some stuff. Also, don't rule out Lowe Alpine - they're being designed in Italy and the cut is really nice on the stuff I've tried recently. See the Volition, which is their women's Powershield jacket and the Women's Multi Pitch, which is more Schoeller-esque.
Thanks Jon. I know Schoeller is more breathable, but I want something that is more wind resistant for faffing about on top of Stanage in winter! I'll have a look at the ones you suggest - it's just trying them on that's going to be the problem, hence Lakes dealers needed. As for the Arc'teryx ones - yes, if only!! I think the budget is about £130
I have the Berghaus Baltoro (wore at Wales) and it's very good. Breathable, stretchy and water resistant. Only slight niggle is the price (£150) and the main pocket zips undo bottom to top.
I keep suggesting howies equiptment...no I don't work for them... so to as if to create a reputation...try a howies cross jacket scholler 3xdry bonded fleece, windproof, water resistant, very breathable, £120, womens specific, very interesting look, but good luck on finding a local stockist!
The good news is if you don't like it for any reason you can send it back for free, they send a return label with their stuff. howies.co.uk and save the earth at the same time!
It's hard to keep track of the different grades of Schoeller these days, as, like many fabrics, new versions seem to come out all the time, and different manufacturers use different versions.
I too find plain old Schoeller Dynamic (stretch woven nylon, smooth inner & outer faces, no insulation) to be a little too permeable. The Schoeller clone used in the Peter Storm soft shell seems to be a closer, or different weave, and is more impermeable. The fluffed inner face probably helps in this regard, and makes it very nice to wear next to the skin, but it's not very warm. And, as it's only available in black, not recommended for summer alpine use.
Schoeller Extreme seems to be a development of Dynamic, with a light insulating inner layer. Since I haven't used it, I can only guess that this will improve the windproofing, and add some warmth.
PowerShield is available in a number of weights (and different face fabrics, too...), and seems to hit the 'Goldilocks factor' permeability for me. I'd be tempted to look for one of these.
The alternative is the microfibre/micropile type (DriClime, Microtherm, etc), which is very windproof, but the face fabric may not be rugged enough for grit and Alpine work (although Mark Twight and Andy Kirkpatrick might disagree). The advantage here is that this style of jacket often has a hood, which I think is very useful.
Marmot have three types of soft shell, M1, 2 & 3, recognising that there are different needs. They have varying levels of air permeability and warmth, and I think the M3 is the 'fast and light' version. This is in addition to their DriClime stuff, which they don't put in their soft shell category. I'd take a good look at their website; loads of soft shells.
A number of manufacturers are moving away form the 'named fabrics', and bringing out their 'own' (i.e. similar fabrics from less well-known mills).
Things that might be worth a look at:
TNF Apex 1: quite impermeable, thin fleece lining Patagonia Figure4: highly impermeable, not insulated Patagonia Core Skin: PowerShield (£230!) Marmot Photon: stretch nylon, has hood. Comes in lovely pink, too... Marmot Scirocco Mammut Anabol: air permeable membrane(?) fabric. hmmm...looks discontinued... replaced by... Mammut Nimba Cloudveil Serendipity: Schoeller Extreme 3xdry (silly 'tree-trunk' collar, though) Arc'teryx Gamma SV: Powershield. Didn't like the tight, fixed cuffs, though.
During this cold weather, I've been using my Aldi winter cycling jacket (for cycling), and find that hits the 'Goldilocks factor' too, and was only £10... It's stretchy, close-fitting, wind resistant and warm. But, as with all specials, not regularly available. Also, the back panel isn't a windproof fabric (sensible enough for cycling, not so for climbing).
I posted my thoughts on the flavours of soft shell a while back, but it sounds like you're already pretty familiar with them.
Thanks Captain, I've also read your musings on such things on UKC. I think one of teh Schoeller or Powershield things is going to be the way to go - at least I'll be able to find them in the shops, all being well. I have a ME Microtherm top at the moment, but it annoys me. The pertex layer rustles and isn't a close fit, so with a harness, it sort of bags over the top a bit. Also I have the smock version which is a pain in the @rse having to pull on and off over the head. I don't want a hood - if it's hood weather, it's eVent shell weather! Otherwise I prefer just to wear a little windstopper beanie.
With any luck I'll be able to try on the Macpac, Lowe Alpine and Marmot offerings at least - cheers :)
Yes, I was going to mention the one drawback of the Microtherm things is lack of stretch, so not close-fitting. The odd thing is, I have a Patagonia Stretch Zephur of this style, but, although the shell is indeed a stretch nylon, it's the baggiest cut of the four things I've got! Go figure...
Don't know where you are, but Slush & Rubble in Chertsey have a wide range of soft shells; that's where many of my notes have come from.
I'm in darkest Coventry :( Go Outdoors has the Rab softshells, and also Berghaus I think, but that's not what I'm after. The Lowe Alpine Volition looks good (although I can't find a stockist of that model anywhere!), as does the Macpac one, and one of the Marmot ones. I don't like the style of the Cloudveil or Howies, from what I've seen online. Actually, I'm in London tomorrow for work, so if I have time (doubtful) I can have a look around there too.
Cara - I have had a schoeller jacket (Marmot) and to be honest i didnt rate it. It was heavy weighing in at 800+ grams, and i found that when moving you overheated very quickly, to sum it up: Only water resistant, no hood, too heavy and warm in summer, and not much good in bad weather such as continuous rain, takes up a lot of pack space. I got rid of it and now have a Rab Baltoro made from the lighter powershield, and this jacket is everything the schoeller should have been, its very light, weighing half (approx 450 grams) as much as the schoeller, which means it can be used in summer like a normal fleece except its a bit more wind and water resistant. It also packs down well. In Black! For winter though you may prefer a heavier version of powershield such as the Baltoro Guide (with a hood as well), however i think that may have the same disadvantages as schoeller as far as weight etc. Instead it may just be wiser (and less expensive) to put extra layers on under the the normal Baltoro.
Cara-Lyn - I wouldn't automatically rule out Windstopper.
I run very hot, but I don't have any sweating problems with my Macpac Vapour (review submitted but yet to be added...).
It uses Windstopper on the front and back but Windpro fleece down the sides and under the arms down to the elbows, which seems to give it enough breathability.
For me it's certainly warm enough around freezing with just a light baselayer (e.g. Coolmax T-shirt) whilst walking.
I haven't been caught in more than a light shower so can't really comment on waterproofness but it seems fairly showerproof.
