Is the Minimus warmer?
Could anyone help with this please?
Montane Nitro - 150g of 800+ US fill Down (no hood) - weight 378g Large
PHD Minimus - ?g of 800 fill down - weight Jacket 360g Smock 300g - PHD reckon its a -5C jacket.
Would the Nitro be warmer? - does anyone have one? Or something with similar fill weight?
If i knew how much down was in the Minimus it would help...
I like phd kit - and the 800 fp down would be maybe 830-850 fp by US norms so it's a scratch above the Montane.
However, I recently saw the sample of the crux pyro and it's a beauty with 900 EU norm down - i.e. as good as the stuff that PHD can put in to order. I've got the old design halo which - despite its known issue with down leak through the seams - has been a superb garment and the updated versions (pyro / new halo) are even better. In that basic stitch-through lightweight design I've not seen anything I'd rather have.
Dunno about that version of the crux thing - its suffering rather from gram shaving one way then putting it back on with zipped pockets etc.
There's a reason that PHD keep the 900 FP down for the ultra vest/pullover (iirc only ~20g of the weight difference from the minimus is down.). Mind, that pocketless pullover one they've got seems entirely sensible.
As for the Nitro vs minimus, I'd be surprised if there was a big warmth difference either way. Maybe minimus slightly warmer - after all there have been magazine reviews putting it ball park equal to the anti freeze.
One thing I am sure about is that you'd need heat pad/mannequin testing to be at all confident. The BPL testing didn't find a great link for anything else. And yes fit will make a non trivial difference to heat retention!
Cheers, they looked about the same ballpark.
Crux Pyro is nice, not sure about stockists tho...
Probably just not arrived anywhere yet - and elusive even at the best of times - people like UOG or Lakes Climber have had some of their stuff before now, so quite possibly at least orderable.
Tried on a large PHD Minimus and found the lower body too boxy for me - no hem drawcord so would be draughty for me.
I suspect the Nitro has a closer 'athletic cut' - it claims a 'body contoured fit'
Montane seem to be going towards a slimmer cut from the recent gear I've tried on.
(e.g. Having tried them on last year I'd need a XL Prism or Fireball - usually I'm a large - even medium in my old Rab Photon - and that's not too many pies - more to do with shoulder width)
Best to call PHD direct.
While they may not be willing to discuss exactly how much down they put in each jacket I am sure that they will give extremely good advice if you discuss your exact needs with them. Also, if a size needs to be tinkered with they will do it.
I've had Minimus jackets of one type or another (jacet / smock / DriShell outer / M1 outer) for years and swear by them. I find the 'boxy' fit is better on me and can offer the down more room to lofy fully and insulate properly than if the jacket fit is too 'athletic'.
Just my thoughts,
depends on your waist size Jim
e.g.on most brands I need a size Large to accomodate my shoulders and arm length
but my actual chest girth is 39 and waist 32. And I have a long torso....
So Boxy doesn't do it for someone shaped like me. Too Draughty without drawstrings at waist and hem...
Nor does the short cut that Rab have started favouring on a lot of their tops.
Martin Carpenter wrote (see)
Mind, that pocketless pullover one they've got seems entirely sensible.
Halo / Pico / Nano are all variants of that from crux. I did wonder why they have produced so many different fill weights but Carol is a big fan of down and reckons there's a use/user for each.
The pockets on the pyro are, I suppose, a way of making it bridge into the down outer jacket market. I tried one on and found it to be of wonderful quality if the design suits your needs.
I also have a PHD Yukon smock in drishell which I save for colder weather and it's excellent kit. It's definitely a 'boxier' cut as has been discussed and the crux offerings suit my longer torso well. I'm about 42" chest, 33-34" waist and I'm on the border of crux M/L and take fit PHD L pretty well too.
Thanks (sorry been away)
I think i may be swayed by whichever is the best deal to come up first (including Crux), doesnt sound that theres too much in it.I dont tend to have a problem with fit, the Nitro does look more fitted.
My Xenon/Montbell combo will do me for most winter trips but was looking for something in case it gets a bit colder. Cheers.
My only really query/complaint with the pico is whether its worth using 900FP down in that sort of design. (well that and the thin baffles, which at that sort of fill weight/power just aren't needed.).
Its only saving ~20g over say 800FP while costing more. Meanwhile there's definetly more weight that could be lost from the basic design. Hence say an M1 outer, 800FP minimus smock still probably being lighter.
Shrug. Only really an issue for purists
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