Primaloft/down jacket for layering?

17 messages
07/12/2011 at 16:52
I normally just take a craghoppers micro fleece (or 2 if it's extra cold)to stick on at rest stops, or when I'm belaying/waiting to climb. But this seems like an awkward solution.

Would I be better off just taking a primaloft or down jacket instead? I'd like one that's lightweight and compressible. Not looking for a duvet or belay style jacket.

I'm thinking that primaloft would be better for UK use, what are your opinions?

Will something like the rab generator be as warm/warmer than 2 microfleeces?

If so, what else is available and at a decent price? I'll probably pay up to £150, but would prefer closer to the £100.
07/12/2011 at 17:02
A Haglofs Barrier or Barrier II might fit the bill, better than fleece imo.
07/12/2011 at 19:08
This might be a useful thread about overlayers.
07/12/2011 at 20:17

The Pattagonia Nano puff  is what I think you are looking for. You can use it as an underlayer,  much warmer than fleece,  infact much warmer than you would think it capable of.  compress to small very small size.

07/12/2011 at 20:30

It is a bit over your budget, but the PHD Kappa jacket is extremely good - totally waterproof outer fabric, good Primaloft insulation and also a very practical jacket style cut.

I tested and reviewed one of the prototypes in Lapland back in February and it was good to -20'C with fleece and base layer under it, when I was active.  I think this report is still listed on this site somewhere...?  Since then, any wet/cold UK weather and it has been my jacket of choice.

James

07/12/2011 at 21:25
Just to add, this would be worn under my Montane Halo Stretch shell when the weather is bad.

I have seen the nano puff, it looks pretty good. How does it compare with the rab generator?
07/12/2011 at 21:28
James - thanks but I think the Kappa might be a bit more than I need. I'm really just looking for a mid layer to warm me up on a rest stop. The Kappa seems to be more of a outer layer with features that make it a bit heavier.
07/12/2011 at 22:35
There's quite a lot of these types of jackets on offer at the moment. Most have primaloft (or very similar other fill) in the 60-100g range and have a pertex or other windproof shell, so actually they are all quite similar. The difference comes down to fit, features (hood, pockets) and price.

Berghaus ones, chulu and incinerator I think, can be had for a good price below £100. Montane Flux and Rab Generator are very popular on here. Fit is probably the most important consideration, you mentioned you wear Craghoppers fleeces, so maybe the Craghoppers ClimaPlus jacket, at a very reasonable £51: http://www.craghoppers.com/buy/climaplus-jacket-208010
07/12/2011 at 22:38

Generator vs 2 microfleeces on top? Still warmer. Much more so than one.

Big difference with the generator vs nano puff is the weight difference - 100g/m2 vs 60g/m2. Even 60g/m2 is a lot more than one microfleece mind. I'd guess sort of similar to two.

If you want a little more than 1 microfleece and very light then Motane's fireball say, or the OMM rotor smock or that TNF one etc.

Oh I really would consider the idea of sizing it to go over your shell. Primaloft can take that sort of treatment/saturation OK, and the convenience gain when you're climbing in your waterproof is obviously very real.

07/12/2011 at 22:52

If you're worried about wet weather, don't bother with down; it won't be worth the hassle.

I've grumbled elsewhere about using synthetic insulation as a mid, so I won't repeat myself. My suggestion is to keep one microfleece and carry something warm like the generator for stops; size it to fit over windshells or softshells or whatever you usually wear on the outside (assuming you aren't of the 'goretex all day, everyday' school of dressing). Chances are that a non-lightweight hardshell will fit okay over the top of it already. Overlayering is the way to go.

A waterproof warm layer like the kappa would probably be a bit inconvenient to carry around on the offchance you'll need it, and its probably a bit warm for active outdoors use in the UK. Blah blah blah Paramo blah

07/12/2011 at 23:09
Chris89 wrote (see)
I'm really just looking for a mid layer to warm me up on a rest stop.

Synthetic filled items are at their best when used as an outer layer. A basic, minimally featured bag, basically. Throw it on over everything else you're wearing. If the weather's pish, why would you want to remove outer layers to add a warmer midlayer?

08/12/2011 at 01:22
Gotta agree with Edward---love the nano-puff pull-over---much warmer than I had anticipated it would be---wear it all the time in cold weather and even sitting around at night in the house---can be used as a mid or outer layer---very efficient---comes in a "hoody" full-zip jacket version that may suit your needs Chris89---397g and super compressible---stuffs into its own pocket
08/12/2011 at 08:52
hmm, I guess your right. If the weather was bad, it would be more handy just to stick it over the top of the shell. The nano puff seems pretty good, it is water resistant so would it be suitable for that?
08/12/2011 at 09:49

Thats the basic point of synth insulation It holds its warmth OK when saturated then dries out afterwards. So any set up with it will work reasonably.

You can get more resistant fabrics than the nano puff without going to the extra weight/expense of a built in shell mind. Just coated stuff as per pertex endurance - large parts of ME Fitzroy/RAB generator alpine/PHDs sigma etc. Not fully waterproof but quite close and a fair bit cheaper/lighter than the fully insulated shells.

08/12/2011 at 21:27

Also there is the Rab Photon jacket -

a little cheaper than the Generator alpine.

I've had one for 3 years* I mainly use mine as an overlayer, but if it's really cold n wet, in Scotland once up on a windy Munro ridge walk, I have used it as an  midlayer under my eVent shell and it was fine. Mine is Black, and I am happy to wear it casually too.

*It's Primaloft sport now not PL1 , but I wouldn't get too hung up on the difference myself - PL sport will probably retain more loft for longer though it's slightly less warm for it's weight than PL1 and  a little less compressible - not  that that I compress mine much as it's not a good thing in the long run.

Edited: 08/12/2011 at 21:47
09/12/2011 at 00:07
Snugpak's range is pretty ideal too and cheap as chips!
11/12/2011 at 21:46

my 2p worth....a windproof would also help.

a jacket is heavier and perhaps not as good a fit, but you want something to throw on top [and take off] quickly .

Rab photon is great, but maybe not warm enough? easy to fit under shells as well if needs be.
Snugpak and Keela are certainly worth looking at. I'd always go for a hood, but make sure you can stow it to stop it flapping and filling with snow

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