Mountain Equipment Firefox Jacket

Posted: 28/06/2011 at 19:05

Posted: 28/06/2011 at 19:42

Posted: 28/06/2011 at 22:32

I work on the product team at ME and I thought it was worth coming on to clarify a few of the points raised above. 

Bellie is right, the Firefox is currently a Cotswold exclusive and this is why it doesn’t appear on the website.  As of late summer/ early autumn it will be a widely available part of our range and details will be displayed a per other products.  Regarding the Firefox name, as Martin mentions, there will briefly be room for some confusion.  The Active Shell Firefox is essentially an evolution of the existing model.  Hopefully the cosmetic and functional differences will avoid too many issues during the short period where both are available.  It should be said the current model is still an excellent choice as a very lightweight Pro Shell jacket with all the benefits that the fabric brings.

Cont. below

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 11:30

Overall I would say that Jon’s comments were very fair but I think it’s worth emphasising a few points, particularly regarding the fabric.  Active Shell is in no way intended to replace Pro Shell.  Pro Shell is still the best choice for extended use in very severe conditions and I would always prefer it for most winter walking and climbing, extended backpacking with a heavy sack and other times when the greater durability will be required. 

Where Active Shell excels is for fast moving ‘done in a day’ type activities where it’s exceptional breathability will be appreciated.  This is the only waterproof fabric I’ve used that I can comfortably run in and during my previous life as a Mountaineering Instructor I’ve used pretty much everything!  With this in mind we’ve recently had the Firefox on test with some very high standard fell runners who’ve been racing in the recent Scottish and Lakes weather in it.  Whilst it was commented that slightly lighter jackets were available all were extremely impressed by the breathability.  The Firefox is definitely not just an Alpine shell in our opinion.

Once the Firefox becomes widely available we will also be releasing the Firelite, this is a super simple version with just one small bonded chest pocket.  It weighs 270g and will be £180.

I’ll try to check back later so if anyone has any questions please let me know.

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 11:31

Thanks Richard, I'm going to write a quick blog post later on where Active Shell fits in the whole Gore-Tex hierarchy as it does sort of crossover a little and different brands have treated it differently in terms of application.

I'd agree with your comments on breathability. In alpine terms, I think you could use it as a back up to a fully featured alpine soft shell like your own Orbital jacket, but I'd agree, it's not really a technical alpine piece in the accepted sense. Then again, it's not really an obvious running/biking jacket either.

One question for you, inside the jacket, there's a stretch cord tag with the enigmatic label, 'No Hang' by it, which made me smile. I assume it's, erm, no, I'm not going to assume. I guess it's to fold the hood down? There's an image of it above. 

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 12:17

Hi Jon, 

Yes, you assume right, the stretch cord is for securing the hood when it's rolled down!  Gore's rules on weight and build were extremely strict for Active Shell products this season and the emphasis was on features being as minimal as possible.

 What I said before was that in my view the Firefox isn't only an Alpine shell.  It will certainly be what I take out to the Alps later this summer either to back up a soft shell or to wear in it's own right when weight is critical on harder routes.  This said, I will be being fairly careful around off-width granite cracks when I'm wearing it!  As a side point, it's probably fairly close to the perfect ski-touring jacket.  You're right that it's not an out and out running or biking shell but rather an all-round mountain piece designed to fit over a chunky thermal or micro-fleece when necessary. Several runners have commented that the forthcoming, simpler, Firelite Jacket is excellent out on the fells and this might be a better choice for those who prefer something more minimal.

Richard

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 12:49

"Close to the perfect ski touring jacket"... without a wired hood?

When it's raining on skis it's generally sleet too and has a habit of being very unpleasantly wind blown, at least when I've been touring.  Since my idea of skiing in a hard shell waterproof is something done as little as possible I would appreciate the low packed weight and volume, but for close to perfection it would need a wired hood in my book.  My existing "throw it in the bottom of the bag and hope I don't use it" skiing waterproof is an old Lowe Atom.  It doesn't have a wired hood, which informs me very well every time I'm in wind blown sleet how much better wires are than "soft stiffened" peaks.  If it weren't for the wired-peak Mountain Cap I wear with it I'd have changed it by now.

Pete.

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 13:06

Hi Pete,

Generally we put a wired peak on all the waterproof shells that we make but in this case we felt it was a sacrifice worth making given the type of product the Firefox was.  It is still a fully adjustable hood with a stiffened edge to the peak and I've found that in my use of the jacket to date it fits well enough for it not to be a serious issue. That said, for sustained use in severe weather I would prefer one of our more substantial Pro Shells with their 'belt and braces' hoods!  We are developing other Active Shell models to run alongside the Firefox and Firelite in future and I know that a slightly more substantial product, almost certainly with a wired hood, is in the pipeline.

 Richard

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 13:33

Thanks for the details Richard.  I'm not particularly criticising your decision to leave out the wire given the design spec, btw, just taking minor issue with describing something without one as "close to the perfect ski touring jacket"...

Everyone in the stands is an expert, of course, but I imagine you knew that already!

Pete.

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 14:43

Hi Pete,

All feedback is gratefully received!  It's always good to discuss these things and explain our thinking but what works for me won't necessarily be perfect for you of course.  Hopefully you could find something that suits your requirements amongst our range.

 Richard 

Posted: 29/06/2011 at 14:58

Berghaus have one of these out with a wired hood.  http://www.outdoorsmagic.com/reviews/jackets/shell-jackets---waterproof/berghaus-velum-jacket/review/37306.htmlReviewed here

It's in my local Cotswold too.  (Both in the window, as they ar emaking a big thing of it.  Doesn't look as appealing as the Firefox, and maybe not as much brand appeal either, but maybe better specced? 

Posted: 05/07/2011 at 20:03

Berghaus women's version has no storm flap (have not checked the men's) and pit zips. colours are quite nice though

Posted: 16/07/2011 at 11:07

As per the review here (link above) the mens version doesn't either. Which really does seem at least somewhat silly! Well maybe a RIRI zip at the least etc.

Ok it won't leak hugely or anything, especially not initially, but doesn't the seal on these WKK waterproof zips degrade at least a little over time? Or under pressure such as someone filling those pockets....

Especially in such a high profile launch item? Seems almost designed to set people blaming the new fabric for the eventual leaks through the zip. Actually I'm slightly surprised that Gore let them do it.

Posted: 16/07/2011 at 17:54

Hi Richard @ ME, just purchased one of the womens firefox jackets and cannot figure out how the 'no hang' stretch cord - as you say for securing the hood if rolled - secures the rolled hood!

May be being thick, but love to know how. Great jacket very impressed so far.

Smiles (on behalf of Giulia)

Posted: 13/08/2011 at 19:23

Posted: 13/08/2011 at 23:45